Heavy-hitter DI shootout! Also, my best Recto tone yet!

Metaltastic · January 26th, 2009, 06:48 PM

Hey guys, as promised awhile ago, here's my gondo DI shootout - I own a Little Labs Redeye, and wanted to see how it would stack up against some heavy hitter DI's. So I found a Countryman Type 85 and a Radial J48 for good prices on ebay, and bought them for the sake of this test! You're welcome

Ta-da...

So I recorded the same riff as tightly as I could through each DI box, AND I used both my Ibanez Prestige with an EMG85 in the bridge and my housemate's Dean Evo with a Dimebucker (I know, I know, but at least it's passive!), so you guys could get the full picture! Then I reamped it throuhg my usual setup (Redeye --> TS7 --> 2 ch. Dual Rec Red channel --> Stiletto slant 4x12 --> SM57 mic'ing the bottom left speaker --> Mackie Onyx Satellite). So without further ado, here's the files!

It's a blind shootout, though I will say that the letters are the same for both guitars (e.g. a = a, etc.) Enjoy, and happy guessing! And the riff is my own from my last band.

EDIT: And here's a link to the DI's

MetalJonesy · January 26th, 2009, 06:52 PM

haha i noticed that pic on ur photobucket last night!! just downloading now!

MetalJonesy · January 26th, 2009, 06:56 PM

listening to the duncan shootout, tone a is alot crisper than tone B, b sounds a tiny tiny bit more muffled, and c sounds like a very slightly thinner version of a.

Think i prefer A, but the differences are tiny!!!!

on the EMG i think i still prefer A but C is also nice, however the differences between the 3 are totally less apparent than with the passive!!!

Metaltastic · January 26th, 2009, 09:45 PM

Yeah, C is my least favorite personally - and listening back after some time, I realize this tone is still X-TREME low mids, so at least I can be that much more certain the 85 has got to go! But yeah, keep the comments coming, I would think there would be tons of interest in this!

Melodeath · January 26th, 2009, 10:18 PM

Going to listen later tonight

Loren Littlejohn · January 26th, 2009, 10:45 PM

Sorry I haven't shipped the reamp yet. I plan to tomorrow, along with some china.

Fuckers at Macys don't know the difference between pure red and parchment red. Even with it clearly spelled out on the invoice.

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 12:36 AM

Haha, sounds good Loren - so any thoughts on the clips?

mintcheerios · January 27th, 2009, 01:25 AM

Thanks for the test. I think I'll have to agree with MetalJonesy except that I don't prefer any particular one for the active pickup. I wish you had done this before I bought my DI box! Also, nice tone.

Just curious, was the 80hz high-pass rumble feature enabled on the J48?

ex-250 · January 27th, 2009, 01:31 AM

they go in order of how much i like them. A = best ---> C = worst

Ermz · January 27th, 2009, 01:33 AM

Hey man, thanks a heap for doing this.

I'm finding it hard to tell which I prefer, since all of the tones sound very unpleasant to me. But relatively it seems like A is the thinnest and sharpest sounding out of the bunch. In real world examples that might amount to retaining the most fidelity. C seems like a thinner version of B, somewhere in between A and B's tone but that may or may not be a good thing, depending on where all the low-mid cloudiness is coming from. B is definitely the most muddy sounding.

In this shoot-out, out of the Dimebucker tests, I would say A is voiced the best. With the EMGs I could barely tell enough of a difference to comment. It seems the differences are more pronounced with passives.

All in all the differences are so minute that they don't seem consequential at all!

Kadmium · January 27th, 2009, 01:43 AM

Awesome stuff. Thank you so much for posting these. Confirms what I suspected, as with the mic pre shootout; they all sound pretty much identical.

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 01:43 AM

Thanks guys! Ermz, come on, don't hold back, say what you really feel!

But hey, I'll take a critique over no response any day! I had the bass ridiculously low on these clips, like 9:30, so it's either the 85 or the cab creating all those core mids (300-500 I'd say) - I wanna try some other pickups before I bail on the Stiletto, though! And mintcheerios, I didn't have the HPF engaged on the J48, so it was totally flat.

Ermz · January 27th, 2009, 01:45 AM

Yeah, I'm really curious to hear which is which. I think at the end of the day, each may be tailored to a different set-up, though I do get a niggling feeling that the ones with the most low-mids may be the 'lowest quality', because one of the first aspects of fidelity you lose with this many signal processes is high-end, so it could be that A is 'the best'. Who knows really...

Shadow_Walker · January 27th, 2009, 03:57 AM

I liked C for the Emg and A for the Duncan, B has some nasty low-mids/lows.

alexrookie · January 27th, 2009, 07:16 AM

glad to hear that they are all working good!

i think the differences in sound are more a matter of performance than the boxes themself.

thx for the test.

Dandelium · January 27th, 2009, 09:09 AM

A sounds better both cases.

B sounds muffled, my least favourite

C sounds ok for both pickups, but maybe a bit too muffled with the passives.

grywolf627 · January 27th, 2009, 10:27 AM

Thanks for doing this Marucs! Interesting how we all have different tastes. Of course, my ears are still tired from working on that solo bit all last night, but for the EMG's, I prefer A, then, C, then B.

For the passives, I prefer C, then B, then A. But (at least on these headphones at work), there's only slight differences in all of them. Throw them in a full mix, and I think it would be even less perceptible. (?)

Unavailable · January 27th, 2009, 11:05 AM

Listening on headphones atm, but there was a noticeable difference between A and the others. I liked A the best.

ParsonsMatt · January 27th, 2009, 11:34 AM

You should upload the DIs and let everyone reamp them

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 11:38 AM

Yeah, I will after I reveal the results

Ermz · January 27th, 2009, 11:43 AM

Speaking of which.... when will that be?

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 11:47 AM

I wanna get a few more guesses, so probably later today!

The_Shred · January 27th, 2009, 12:10 PM

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 12:27 PM

Ok, well I won't reveal the results yet, but I will put in my impressions:

For the EMG, you guys are crazy if you think there's anything more than a 1% difference between A and B - I'm listening in my semi-treated room on good monitors that I know pretty damn well, and they're damn near indistinguishable (performance notwithstanding). C on the other hand is thinner and harsher IMO, so I really don't like it.

For the Dimebucker, I feel B is indeed the most muffled and my least favorite, but not by much, goddamn - A is the best, then C close behind (still a bit thin/harsh, but not as noticeable/bothersome to me as with the EMG).

Metaltastic · January 27th, 2009, 12:29 PM

And still waiting on Bernhard, Damian, Joe (Davis), Mike, Stee, and other dudes who I'd consider chums

January 26th, 2009, 06:48 PM	#1 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Heavy-hitter DI shootout! Hey guys, as promised awhile ago, here's my gondo DI shootout - I own a Little Labs Redeye, and wanted to see how it would stack up against some heavy hitter DI's. So I found a Countryman Type 85 and a Radial J48 for good prices on ebay, and bought them for the sake of this test! You're welcome Ta-da... So I recorded the same riff as tightly as I could through each DI box, AND I used both my Ibanez Prestige with an EMG85 in the bridge and my housemate's Dean Evo with a Dimebucker (I know, I know, but at least it's passive!), so you guys could get the full picture! Then I reamped it throuhg my usual setup (Redeye --> TS7 --> 2 ch. Dual Rec Red channel --> Stiletto slant 4x12 --> SM57 mic'ing the bottom left speaker --> Mackie Onyx Satellite). So without further ado, here's the files! It's a blind shootout, though I will say that the letters are the same for both guitars (e.g. a = a, etc.) Enjoy, and happy guessing! And the riff is my own from my last band. EDIT: And here's a link to the DI's __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace Last edited by Metaltastic : April 7th, 2009 at 11:45 AM.

January 26th, 2009, 06:52 PM	#2 (permalink)
MetalJonesy more metal, more booze!!! Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Darlington/Manchester UK Posts: 2,219	haha i noticed that pic on ur photobucket last night!! just downloading now! __________________ -Available for mixing/remixing projects-

January 26th, 2009, 06:56 PM	#3 (permalink)
MetalJonesy more metal, more booze!!! Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Darlington/Manchester UK Posts: 2,219	listening to the duncan shootout, tone a is alot crisper than tone B, b sounds a tiny tiny bit more muffled, and c sounds like a very slightly thinner version of a. Think i prefer A, but the differences are tiny!!!! on the EMG i think i still prefer A but C is also nice, however the differences between the 3 are totally less apparent than with the passive!!! __________________ -Available for mixing/remixing projects-

January 26th, 2009, 09:45 PM	#4 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Yeah, C is my least favorite personally - and listening back after some time, I realize this tone is still X-TREME low mids, so at least I can be that much more certain the 85 has got to go! But yeah, keep the comments coming, I would think there would be tons of interest in this! __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 26th, 2009, 10:45 PM	#6 (permalink)
Loren Littlejohn Lover of all boobage. Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Auburn NY- we grow em you listen Posts: 6,733	Sorry I haven't shipped the reamp yet. I plan to tomorrow, along with some china. Fuckers at Macys don't know the difference between pure red and parchment red. Even with it clearly spelled out on the invoice. __________________ Mac Pro Quad Xeon 2.0gHz 4GIG RAM, Cubase studio 5 and PT LE 8. "Remember, you're dealing with people who can't remember where beat four is, or how a song is arranged, or how to tune an instrument. What makes you think they're going to remember to clean up after themselves? " -Glenn Fricker My Studio Myspace Page

January 27th, 2009, 12:36 AM	#7 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Haha, sounds good Loren - so any thoughts on the clips? __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 27th, 2009, 01:25 AM	#8 (permalink)
mintcheerios Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 406	Thanks for the test. I think I'll have to agree with MetalJonesy except that I don't prefer any particular one for the active pickup. I wish you had done this before I bought my DI box! Also, nice tone. Just curious, was the 80hz high-pass rumble feature enabled on the J48? Last edited by mintcheerios : January 27th, 2009 at 01:34 AM.

January 27th, 2009, 01:31 AM	#9 (permalink)
ex-250 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 15	they go in order of how much i like them. A = best ---> C = worst

January 27th, 2009, 01:33 AM	#10 (permalink)
Ermz Ma baws ist Krieg Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 14,307	Hey man, thanks a heap for doing this. I'm finding it hard to tell which I prefer, since all of the tones sound very unpleasant to me. But relatively it seems like A is the thinnest and sharpest sounding out of the bunch. In real world examples that might amount to retaining the most fidelity. C seems like a thinner version of B, somewhere in between A and B's tone but that may or may not be a good thing, depending on where all the low-mid cloudiness is coming from. B is definitely the most muddy sounding. In this shoot-out, out of the Dimebucker tests, I would say A is voiced the best. With the EMGs I could barely tell enough of a difference to comment. It seems the differences are more pronounced with passives. All in all the differences are so minute that they don't seem consequential at all! __________________ Quality Professional Recording \| Mixing \| Mastering Now offering REAMPING

January 27th, 2009, 01:43 AM	#11 (permalink)
Kadmium Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 260	Awesome stuff. Thank you so much for posting these. Confirms what I suspected, as with the mic pre shootout; they all sound pretty much identical.

January 27th, 2009, 01:43 AM	#12 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Thanks guys! Ermz, come on, don't hold back, say what you really feel! But hey, I'll take a critique over no response any day! I had the bass ridiculously low on these clips, like 9:30, so it's either the 85 or the cab creating all those core mids (300-500 I'd say) - I wanna try some other pickups before I bail on the Stiletto, though! And mintcheerios, I didn't have the HPF engaged on the J48, so it was totally flat. __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 27th, 2009, 01:45 AM	#13 (permalink)
Ermz Ma baws ist Krieg Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 14,307	Yeah, I'm really curious to hear which is which. I think at the end of the day, each may be tailored to a different set-up, though I do get a niggling feeling that the ones with the most low-mids may be the 'lowest quality', because one of the first aspects of fidelity you lose with this many signal processes is high-end, so it could be that A is 'the best'. Who knows really... __________________ Quality Professional Recording \| Mixing \| Mastering Now offering REAMPING

January 27th, 2009, 03:57 AM	#14 (permalink)
Shadow_Walker Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Bulgaria Posts: 2,072	I liked C for the Emg and A for the Duncan, B has some nasty low-mids/lows.

January 27th, 2009, 07:16 AM	#15 (permalink)
alexrookie Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: hanover,germany Posts: 165	glad to hear that they are all working good! i think the differences in sound are more a matter of performance than the boxes themself. thx for the test.

January 27th, 2009, 09:09 AM	#16 (permalink)
Dandelium Erik Monsonís Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Szeged, Hungary Posts: 1,822	A sounds better both cases. B sounds muffled, my least favourite C sounds ok for both pickups, but maybe a bit too muffled with the passives. __________________

January 27th, 2009, 10:27 AM	#17 (permalink)
grywolf627 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 1,727	Thanks for doing this Marucs! Interesting how we all have different tastes. Of course, my ears are still tired from working on that solo bit all last night, but for the EMG's, I prefer A, then, C, then B. For the passives, I prefer C, then B, then A. But (at least on these headphones at work), there's only slight differences in all of them. Throw them in a full mix, and I think it would be even less perceptible. (?) __________________ -Mark No trees were harmed in the making of this post. Several electrons, however, were severely inconvenienced.

January 27th, 2009, 11:05 AM	#18 (permalink)
Unavailable Senior Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 1,638	Listening on headphones atm, but there was a noticeable difference between A and the others. I liked A the best. __________________

January 27th, 2009, 11:34 AM	#19 (permalink)
ParsonsMatt Alas, Tyranny Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Athens, GA Posts: 1,524	You should upload the DIs and let everyone reamp them __________________ Alas, Tyranny Guitars: Edwards E-FR-120GT (DiMarzio X2N/Air Norton), ESP Horizon NT-II (DiMarzio Evolution/EJ Custom), Yamaha LS6, Warwick Rockbass Corvette-5 Amps: Roland Microcube Mics: Shure SM7b, EV PL80a Other: RME Fireface 400, Event ASP6 x2, M-Audio KeyRig 49e

January 27th, 2009, 11:38 AM	#20 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Yeah, I will after I reveal the results __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 27th, 2009, 11:43 AM	#21 (permalink)
Ermz Ma baws ist Krieg Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 14,307	Speaking of which.... when will that be? __________________ Quality Professional Recording \| Mixing \| Mastering Now offering REAMPING

January 27th, 2009, 11:47 AM	#22 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	I wanna get a few more guesses, so probably later today! __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 27th, 2009, 12:10 PM	#23 (permalink)
The_Shred Jaymz Join Date: May 2006 Location: Darlington Posts: 4,171	A

January 27th, 2009, 12:27 PM	#24 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	Ok, well I won't reveal the results yet, but I will put in my impressions: For the EMG, you guys are crazy if you think there's anything more than a 1% difference between A and B - I'm listening in my semi-treated room on good monitors that I know pretty damn well, and they're damn near indistinguishable (performance notwithstanding). C on the other hand is thinner and harsher IMO, so I really don't like it. For the Dimebucker, I feel B is indeed the most muffled and my least favorite, but not by much, goddamn - A is the best, then C close behind (still a bit thin/harsh, but not as noticeable/bothersome to me as with the EMG). __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace

January 27th, 2009, 12:29 PM	#25 (permalink)
Metaltastic The call of the couch Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: New York, USA Posts: 19,241	And still waiting on Bernhard, Damian, Joe (Davis), Mike, Stee, and other dudes who I'd consider chums __________________ Guitars: Ibanez Prestige RGA321F (EMG 81's @ 18v); Fender MIM Jazz Bass (Bart's) Amps: Mesa Recto Standard Slant 4x12; Old Mesa Vert. 2x12; Ibanez TS7 Recording: RAIN Recording Livebook; REAPER; Mackie Onyx 400F; SM57; Tannoy Reveal 5A's; Audio Tech. ATH-M50's; LL Redeye; Superior 2.0; Voxengo Elephant Myspace