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Old September 29th, 2011, 02:32 PM   #26 (permalink)
Condemnation
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"Production - sound isn't the best, ie, thin, lacking that something
Mixing - can't hear certain instruments, certain sounds are 'buried'
Mastering - too loud"

Yeah, and how the hell can all 3 be messed up??? Unbelievable!

Oh, and I've still not yet recieved my cd... it's been delayed says the web store where I bought it.... *sigh*
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Old September 30th, 2011, 06:19 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Okay but all those sticky production issues aside, this is one hell of an album! Lyrically as intense and invested as anything thus far including the hallowed ground of Parker's Eyes, as engaging musically as we've had yet... I mean after the epic Snowfall I certainly didn't feel they could top that and to be honest was a little concerned Coil was coming around a little tooo soon after that masterpiece, but after the trip and then some that Nick has endured it all makes crazy sense. I'm usually let down by production flaws but I don't think this is so bad. And I've managed to move past it based on the quality of the material. Beautiful beautiful stuff... Personal fave yet again, while not quite as cutting as Snowfall maybe Origins, those smooth Ray vocals. And completely agree his best performances have been these past years...

It would be a shame to miss the true brilliance of this release by not hearing past some production issues... Nick has stepped up again, Redemption continues to be THE progressive act of the moment!

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Old September 30th, 2011, 12:53 PM   #28 (permalink)
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@WardyS1

I agree with you. Even though I wish they would consider correcting some of the mistakes (like Nevermore did on Enemies of Reality)... I still think it's pretty decent. I CAN listen to the record and appreciate the lyrics and the music. It sure is one heck of an album, really strong and probably, no, most certainly my favourite album of 2011.
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Old September 30th, 2011, 01:05 PM   #29 (permalink)
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For me, the horrible production aside, the writing is mostly uninspired and bland. The melodies are not memorable, and they don't gel with Ray's vocals. I find the riffing terribly derivative and puny. This is their worst album for me. And the production is not a minor problem, as I don't like the mastering on the new Sun Caged either. The writing saves them, though. This one, on the other hand, is almost unbearable.
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Old September 30th, 2011, 02:31 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Wow Batmura... that was pretty harsh. I respect your opinion of course. But I cannot understand uninspired and bland, and melodies that aren't memorable.

I'm still curious, which songs are the best ones and which one are the worst, the ones u cannot stand at all?
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Old September 30th, 2011, 07:19 PM   #31 (permalink)
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Thumbs down

Quote:
Originally Posted by batmura View Post
For me, the horrible production aside, the writing is mostly uninspired and bland. The melodies are not memorable, and they don't gel with Ray's vocals. I find the riffing terribly derivative and puny. This is their worst album for me. And the production is not a minor problem, as I don't like the mastering on the new Sun Caged either. The writing saves them, though. This one, on the other hand, is almost unbearable.
I agree! I only like 2 songs on the entire album... Sorry Redemption, I'm passing on this one.
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Old October 2nd, 2011, 04:24 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batmura View Post
For me, the horrible production aside, the writing is mostly uninspired and bland. The melodies are not memorable, and they don't gel with Ray's vocals. I find the riffing terribly derivative and puny. This is their worst album for me. And the production is not a minor problem, as I don't like the mastering on the new Sun Caged either. The writing saves them, though. This one, on the other hand, is almost unbearable.
Yeah disappointed to hear that but to each their own...

Personally though I can't get some of these melodies outta my head, No Ticket Funeral is a massive chorus to my ears and lyrically cool, Stronger Than Death is major singalong and the riffs in that one my highlight, Begin Again another with killer hooks and Let It Rain is beautiful, heartfelt emotional and melody to die for...

Overall there's more here I'm returing to than I think I did even at this early stage with Snowfall, maybe Origins was more instant for me too but Coil is still digging it's claws in something fresh with each listen... Can hear the Pale Horse departing best be going then

Anyone notice the clever finish in Pale Horse, the way it features all the other tunes to conclude the album? Nice touch...
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Old October 2nd, 2011, 12:10 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Batmura, that WAS a bit harsh. I have to agree with Wardy. I think the more I listen, the more I like it. Just like the vast majority of Prog Rock/Prog metal, it takes more than one or two listens to really formulate an accurate opinion. And our opinions are always subject to change. I hope, Batmura, that you will give the album another shot or two and see if your opinion has changed.

Wardy, after listening to Pale Horse once I got the album, on my second full listen I realized that this could practically be considered a loose "concept" album, as all the songs relate to Nick's battle over cancer.
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Old October 2nd, 2011, 12:31 PM   #34 (permalink)
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beowulk1969:

I've had the promo for nearly a month and I've given this album about 80 spins. Sorry, it's not doing it for me. I've also posted my indepth review:

http://www.seaoftranquility.org/revi...ntent&id=11593

It's not favourable, but I did approach it from an objective viewpoint. I love Redemption and I've been a fan way BEFORE the debut came out. I remember the day the news was posted on the Laser's Edge website and getting excited about it. I have heard and reviewed every Redemption disc and never rated any of their work less than 4 stars (with The Fullness of Time getting a 5 out of 5 from me, which is very rare).

I hope the new album will be an improvement over this. I don't expect another The Fullness of Time, but something on par with Snowfall on Judgment Day would be great.
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Old October 3rd, 2011, 07:04 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Oh, and I've still not yet recieved my cd... it's been delayed says the web store where I bought it.... *sigh*
Same here. Poor show by Century Media, in Europe at least.
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Old October 3rd, 2011, 09:04 AM   #36 (permalink)
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I'm digging this album so far (listening to it at work for the first time as I type this). I hear what you guys are saying about the production not being so great. I'll say this though; a lot of metal these days sounds overproduced and 'processed' (if that makes sense). Sometimes I like that raw feel and sound. But yeah, the production (not to sound contradicting) could have been a little better here. There's a fine line between over-producing and sounding muddy (resulting from poor production).
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Old October 3rd, 2011, 09:46 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by batmura View Post
beowulk1969:

I've had the promo for nearly a month and I've given this album about 80 spins. Sorry, it's not doing it for me.
Fair enough, Batmura. I know you can't please all the people all the time, as the old saying goes. I love the new album, though at this point I still feel there are a couple of songs from Snowfall that are truly stunning and emotional (for me, anyway): Black and White World and Love Kills Us All/Life in One Day. But the new stuff I think is wonderful and personal to Nick, and very emotional as well.

Everyone's entitled to their own opinions. Ultimately, your opinion is wrong, but... just kidding.
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Old October 3rd, 2011, 11:01 AM   #38 (permalink)
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@Batmura

I read your review, and I totally respect every single word you wrote. And I mostly agree, although I think the songs, the music and the lyrics, are better than what you express. But as I said, I can understand where you're coming from.

@beowulf1969

I agree, Black and White World, is/was a superb song, very emotional. I felt deeply moved the first time I listened to Keep Breathing as well... I kind of miss that magic on this new cd. Now, if I'm being really critical, this is kind of shitty because that emotional magic is what I thought really seperated Redemption from the rest of the pack.

Just a sidenote, sort of... doesn't Dreams from the Pit sound a lot like a mix of Savatage songs? Love Savatage! :-)
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Old October 3rd, 2011, 08:00 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by batmura View Post
beowulk1969:

I've had the promo for nearly a month and I've given this album about 80 spins. Sorry, it's not doing it for me. I've also posted my indepth review:

http://www.seaoftranquility.org/revi...ntent&id=11593

It's not favourable, but I did approach it from an objective viewpoint. I love Redemption and I've been a fan way BEFORE the debut came out. I remember the day the news was posted on the Laser's Edge website and getting excited about it. I have heard and reviewed every Redemption disc and never rated any of their work less than 4 stars (with The Fullness of Time getting a 5 out of 5 from me, which is very rare).

I hope the new album will be an improvement over this. I don't expect another The Fullness of Time, but something on par with Snowfall on Judgment Day would be great.
Spot on review. I can't believe they left Blink of an Eye like that.

There is some good music to be heard through the terrible production/mastering(No Tickets to the Funeral, Noonday Devil, Focus, Dreams from the Pit), but its hard to listen to this album on headphones. Its just a wall of sound sometimes, that never seems to stop. Kind of like Symphony X's Paradise Lost.Just gives me a headache
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Old October 6th, 2011, 04:29 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batmura View Post
beowulk1969:

I've had the promo for nearly a month and I've given this album about 80 spins. Sorry, it's not doing it for me. I've also posted my indepth review:

http://www.seaoftranquility.org/revi...ntent&id=11593

It's not favourable, but I did approach it from an objective viewpoint. I love Redemption and I've been a fan way BEFORE the debut came out. I remember the day the news was posted on the Laser's Edge website and getting excited about it. I have heard and reviewed every Redemption disc and never rated any of their work less than 4 stars (with The Fullness of Time getting a 5 out of 5 from me, which is very rare).

I hope the new album will be an improvement over this. I don't expect another The Fullness of Time, but something on par with Snowfall on Judgment Day would be great.
Hadn't klicked you're over there working reviews mate firstly gotta say nice, have been visiting seaoftranqulity for years now, one of the better review sites out there so cheers from me keep up the good work. Don't however on this occassion completly agree with your comments although admit genuinely enjoyed your review regardless.

And my thoughts pretty much reflect others above in that the songs are certainly on the great side. In addition to those I've already touched on above, Focus is a beauty with massive hook and melody, and the quality of many of these songs rises em far and above any qualms I might have about the production.

And Ray sounds wonderful, in my humble opinion. His delivery in Blink doesn't bother me any, while it might sound like I'm trying to brush an average painting with a touch up brush, that's def not the case when I say that the occasional broken note from Ray actually lends itself to his and the albums overall emotion and honesty. Maybe an acquried taste (although I think not!), but nearly every vocal Ray gives us tends to resonate with me... Smooth, comforting, yet still manages to nudge those thought balloons

My brother and I share the love for this band and discuss these kinda things in depth and both agree yes final production isn't the best, but at the end of the day it's the songs that matter most, and IMO this nails it, in his words;

'This Mortal Coil... More a tale of survival than Redemption... A course of diagnosis, suffering, soul searching, and cure!'

Rating 9

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Old October 6th, 2011, 12:13 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Wardy,

I couldn't have said it better myself (and I was an English major). I happen to love the emotion Ray is able to project. That's why Black and White World, and Love Kills Us All/Life In One Day are so powerful. Same for so many other songs prior and current.
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Old October 7th, 2011, 02:30 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Am currently listening to the new album for about the numpteenth time ,gets better with every listen great melodies lyrics and another great delivery from ray
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Old October 11th, 2011, 11:12 AM   #43 (permalink)
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Another outstanding effort!!! The original songs are excellent and the covers, wow. Blink of an Eye is my favorite so far. It could have been on Snowfall. What great tone. This is signature Redemption.

Let the U.S. tour begin.
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Old October 13th, 2011, 10:58 PM   #44 (permalink)
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I do agree with the production/mixing on this album being sub-par. Gotta disagree with the rest that review, however. The part of "Blink of an Eye" where Ray's voice cracks was obviously intentionally left on the record. I'm sure the band heard it and realized they stumbled upon a blessing. That part turned an already great song into a near masterpiece. It really connects with the lyrics and helps convey the message of a broken man with nowhere to run. Unable to go back in time to the way things were. Unable to change what's been done. Unable to find his voice. Brilliance, imo. Re-recording that would have been a huge mistake.

Overall, this album is fantastic. It definitely has a different feel to it than past albums due to the subject matter and such. There's also a lot of new ideas brought into the mix; especially with the choruses. It's far too early to know how it holds up it to rest of the band's discography. Individually, I don't think many of the songs quite match up to the strongest from past releases. But as a complete album with every song having an equally important role and everything coming together perfectly from start to finish, I don't think a better job could have been done.

Oh. The covers disc is cool too. It would have been nice to have "The Real Thing" on there as well though!
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Old October 14th, 2011, 09:01 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Ooooh! "The Real Thing". That would've been killer!! But that wouldn't necessarily fall into the category of a song by another artist you wouldn't think a metal band would cover.

I do agree with you wholeheartedly on your comments. I love the choruses. It seems there are more harmonies, layering of the rest of the guys singing back-up. I do hear a note or two of Queensryche (MindCrime) in there, and even a bit of Kansas; all from the influence of NK.





On the count of three....
.
.
.
ONE
.
.
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TOUR
.
.
.
THREE
.
.
.
DALLAS!!
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Old October 14th, 2011, 08:02 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Thank God

I am not alone. I love this band and expected so much more with TMC. I mean you have Neil Kernon working with you. I expected something top notch.

Songwriting on the album is really good, but Ray really needs to quit smoking. Recording quality is crap. They need to throw this to the almighty Andy Sneap and let him clean it up.

The cover songs are crap too. I don't believe Ray didn't match some of Perry's high end on Edge of the Blade. That is one of Journey's coolest songs.

I never thought I would say this again ( i said it when I heard the Live DVD Frozen in time), Ray needs a break. There is no conviction anymore.

The guitar work is A number 1. Solos are quite good.

.......and yes, I am a singer and a recording engineer.
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Old October 14th, 2011, 11:44 PM   #47 (permalink)
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I don't believe Ray didn't match some of Perry's high end on Edge of the Blade. That is one of Journey's coolest songs.
Oh, for sure. It's not possible for Ray to hit those notes anymore. The first thing I thought when I saw the tracklisting was "I would have loved to hear Ray Alder circa-1998 sing that song." Still, I enjoyed it much more than expected. He added a more aggressive edge to the vocal delivery which was cool.

Ray's voice is what it is and what it has been for years now. I appreciate that he's adapted his style of singing to what his current range allows. He doesn't just sing everything and octave lower. On every new recording, I hear new things he's never done before. Obviously, a lot of that to do with the strength of Nick's writing, but I think he does a great job with the execution.

As far as live performances go, I saw him last year with Fates on the Parallels tour and to me he sounded better than he did in 2007.
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Old October 15th, 2011, 10:14 AM   #48 (permalink)
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sniff sniff

It really kills me that this CD wasn't better. I almost feel like crying.

Ray, quit smoking and you'll get your range back. YOU KNOW I am correct. Smoking dries out the throat and chords. That note in Blink of an Eye never should've been passed by. It was an obvious mistake of a dry, fatigued voice. I have had those, " Aww that sounded really cool" moments in the studio. That was not one. Edge of the Blade has dry notes all over, it made me pause and re-listen to see if that actually made it to press.

This "new" style that Ray has developed over the years is just getting lazier and more mundane. You ARE RAY FUCKIN ALDER, you need to sing like you should.......................John Arch sure sounds DAMN good on the new ARCH/MATHEOS cd and he's got a couple of years on ya.

I just tell myself maybe Neil Kernon is just too expensive, or InsideOut just doesn't have the funds. I say you start a Sneap fund, shit, I know a 20 year old that can obtain a better mix than this.

As I wipe a tear from my eye, I still love Redemption.
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Old October 15th, 2011, 12:42 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it Andy Sneap who made Nevermores Enemies of Reality sound outstanding back in 2005???

About Rays voice, yes he should do everything he can to preserve his beautiful voice, but I still think that he would sound awesome... if he were more upfront in the mix. :-)
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Old October 15th, 2011, 05:01 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Sure was, that's what redemption should do as well.

I can hear in the mix the difference in a good Ray vocal and a bad, tired one. Just go listen to the Snowfall CD, you'll hear the difference in everything from the mix of the solos to the balls Ray has on it.

Night and day.
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