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Do you believe?

Discussion in 'Opeth (Archived)' started by NeverIsForever, Jun 3, 2005.

  1. Kenneth R.

    Kenneth R. Cináed

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    yes i am a Christian, and yes i believe microevolution exists, but that we all came from a single celled organism i do not believe. there is no evidence compelling enough for me to believe that thus far presented. i do not really know where we came from (in relation to other organisms), and i don't think any human honestly does. i think God had a hand in it, but you will all disagree.
     
  2. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    Hey great call it BS but provide nothing to dispute it. Lay it on man if you deny it.
    Dawkins shits on creationist. But daintily as he is British
     
  3. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow asoiaf afaict

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    Dawkins is the man for sure.
     
  4. Kenneth R.

    Kenneth R. Cináed

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    its egotistical asinine posts like this one that have caused me to avoid this thread. i prefer civilized discussion and argument rather than this crap. if you feel like furthering this, take it to the philosophy forum. i have no desire to continue this here, what with all the extraneous stupidity.
     
  5. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    Why don't you go to talkorigins.org which is a great reservoir of articles and then see whether or not they can answer any of your doubts? I'm not saying they can answer everything but they can certainly show you the BS of what most claim as problems with evolution. Or keep that closed mind.
     
  6. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    I gave you some civilized discussion and argument. You blinded yourself to it and called everything I put forth as BS, without actually showing me any real evidence or logical arguments. So what if I wrote a post where I said Dawkins shits on creationists? He figurativly does.
     
  7. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow asoiaf afaict

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    Several more arguments for creationists to chew on.

    1) Creationists always talk about how "nothing as complex as an eye could evolve in stages, since a half-eye is no good at all." Darwin himself effectively destroyed this argument by merely observing that there are creatures alive today with eyes in all "stages of development," from a few light-sensitive cells, to a cup-shaped receptor with no proper lens, to eagle eyes far sharper than ours. Other creatures seem to get along fine with half-eyes and even 1/100 eyes.

    Then for the final insult, human (the pinnacle of creation) eyes are clearly an engineering mistake! The retinas are inside out. The nerves and blood vessels come out through the light-sensitive area of the retina, producing a blind spot, then spread over the front of the light-receptor cells, so that light has to get past the fibers into the receptors. Why aren't the nerves and capillaries behind the receptors, where they would be out of the way and there would be no need for a blind spot? Squid eyes are arranged just that way. Since ours aren't, one is reminded of the maxim that evolution has to work with the materials at hand, adapting systems already in place, with results that often seem jury-rigged or needlessly complicated. Would an Ultimate Engineer make such an obvious blunder, especially having got it right in creatures created earlier?

    2) So the universe comes from randomness, and order only comes as a result of a conscious intent? When sand trickles down into a pile, the pile is conical. Now a cone is an ordered shape. Does God, therefore, organize each collision of one grain against another so as to fulfill his purpose that the pile be conical? Is there some reason why He goes to all that trouble? It's a mystery, no doubt. Or maybe, just maybe, dissipative systems like this can exhibit spontaneous order-forming behavior. Other dissipative systems include crystal growth, snowflake formation and--horrors--organic life itself.

    3)...with such birth anomalies as being born with a tail, or covered with fur. Tails (abnormally extended coccyges ) are more common than most people realize, since they are, of course, surgically removed immediately, and often the child himself is never told. For furry people, refer to the famous Mexican family, several of whom are circus performers.

    These would, of course, be some of the "throwbacks" which creationists assert must, of course, occur if evolution is real. But since evolution is, of course, not true, the good creationist, upon being presented the very evidence he demanded, will, of course, not be fazed in the slightest.

    Of course.

    A small footnote: back in the good old days, when everyone was a literal-creationist, and religion was science (known as the Dark Ages, with good cause), such babies were identified as the spawn of Satan, and killed instantly, along with their mothers, who were, naturally, witches.

    4)What about the hair on the back of our necks which stands up at the very thought that their children might actually be exposed to an evil-lutionist at school. When they stop to think why the hair on the backs of their necks should stand up, at that or any terrifying situation, the only explanation that makes sense is that it's a vestigial reaction inherited from our mammal ancestors. Other mammals' hair rises in response to "hair-raising experiences" as a defense. It's a warning sign of aggression, and may make the animal look bigger and fiercer. We've apparently given up that signal, maybe in favor of words or other body language. About the only trace left is that creepy feeling about nape of the neck and scalp, which is almost impossible for others to see.

    Also, goosebumps were useful in fluffing up our fur to make us warmer.

    There are so many more and so much evidence it is incredible.

    These were taken from here
     
  8. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    Alright back to ghosts, ghostbusters and Opeth.





























    Jesus never existed :tickled:
     
  9. Pseud0

    Pseud0 New Metal Member

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    if he did (probably did - but he isn't the son of god or whatever), he would have been dark skinned. Mediteranian. I lol whenever i see a picture of jesus being white and blonde haired.
     
  10. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow asoiaf afaict

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    Whenever I see the blonde-haired blue-eyed Jesus I always think of the comment, "Man created God in his image", referring to the WASPs and Catholics who created these images.
     
  11. Botfly

    Botfly "I Am"

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    ^Excellent points Jon and Rock.

    Wow, and that talk origins website really clarified alot of misconceptions I had. Seriously, check this out. Cheers :kickass:
     
  12. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    I don't want to be an ass but its Rook not Rock. As in the bird.
     
  13. Jon Snow

    Jon Snow asoiaf afaict

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    You're an ass. :wave:
     
  14. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    Botfly wrote
    Now thats what I like to see. Someone actually going at it with an open mind.

    Try this book Finding Darwin's God by Kenneth Miller. The first part basically cuts through creationist lies and distortion, but the second part, though I consider it really silly, argues for the existence of God because of quantum indeterminancy. I think its crap but its an actual argument, not just pathetic handwringing while saying "But these are my beliefs. How dare you try to enlighten me with your factual propaganda."

    Also anything by Dawkins is usually gold. He's a virulent atheist, but if you can get past that he is good at mainstreaming science. Try these three: Blind Watchmaker, The Selfish Gene, and Extended Phenotype. I'm sure a library should have at least one. Maybe.
     
  15. RookParliament

    RookParliament I *heart* Darwin

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    Maybe I am an ass. Maybe I am. Thats for The Lord to decide. I generally try to be a nice guy actually. But it fails sometimes.
     
  16. drowssap

    drowssap Member

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    We are energy...energy does not go away, it transforms to something else. What? I don't know
     
  17. Justin S.

    Justin S. Member

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    "Its kinda sad when you don’t know the meaning" Lyrics of a GOD.
     
  18. Justin S.

    Justin S. Member

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    Talkorigins is a great site! Very concise and not hostile. Thanks all.
     
  19. Brains for breakfast

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    Manure.

    But I still believe there's more to it than "You die and you dissapear". I don't believe the afterlife crap most religiouns try to pass on, but I guess some form of reincarnation could make sense.
     
  20. drowssap

    drowssap Member

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    My brother always said he wanted to come back as a woman's bycicle seat
     

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