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Getting your loudness?

Discussion in 'F.O.H.' started by Ice Man, Jan 21, 2007.

  1. nwright

    nwright Member

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    I'll have to try light clipping before my master comp...Never thought of it that way.

    I usually start off my mastering chain with a light compressor to mimic an SSL type feel. Probably doesn't do much for me, but it makes me feel better. I'll have to try the GClip in front of the comp.

    Anyway, is there a rule of thumb so to speak on how much to clip? I'm usually not going over 10%.
     
  2. stringy_

    stringy_ Member

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    Just like everything I've encountered that has to do with music production, there are no rule of thumbs. :)

    I'd say drop the threshold for clipping down till you start hearing distortion, then back off a bit. Keep a careful ear on your mix though! Like slate mentioned earlier, if there are parts in your songs where there are big bursts of energy (tom fills, etc.) those will hit the clipper harder.

    Now I'm going to head over to mercenary.com to drool over their $10k Prism converters. When I get out of school, I swear to god, I'm going to buy something like those. Just to look at.
     
  3. Slate

    Slate Member

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    I would strongly advise everyone to do the clipping LAST, after all compression. If you clip before the compressor, you're giving your compressor less headroom, and your also increasing the volume of your clipped peaks. Save clipping for the last thing, or at least last before you do an extra db of limiting.

    As for Prisms... we clip our Lynx Aurora even harder then I could clip the prism. BUT, we use a BIG BEN which really helps the Aurora sound smoother on the top and bigger on the bottom. Best bang for the buck in A/D/A imo.
     
  4. JBroll

    JBroll I MIX WITH PHYSICS!!!!

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    The problem I find with putting one single clip after the compression is that unless you set it to ignore the 'snap' in the front end of the hit entirely (which is what we're trying to tame) you're going to go between 'ineffectual' and 'pumping like a twelve-year-old' and it just won't sound right. I wouldn't necessarily keep to one clip stage if I could get away with taming stuff less noticeably.

    Jeff
     
  5. sparkyness

    sparkyness Explore The Space

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    They might have to rename my RNC if it starts "pumping like a 12 year old"....:D
     
  6. Slate

    Slate Member

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    JBroll I'm thinking two things:
    1. Your mix might be a tad too peaky. Maybe try to lessen the peaks a bit without relying on compression to tame them, or at least you'll need less.

    2. What kind of compressor are you using? You'll want to use something very transparent, and you shouldn't need to use more then a db or two. If you do, I'd go back to the mix and fix the overly peaky things there.

    Let me know if that helps. Or you might be doing fine.. at the end of the day if it sounds good it is good.
     
  7. JBroll

    JBroll I MIX WITH PHYSICS!!!!

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    Erm...

    Seeing as how we were discussing fixes to peaky mixes, and properly done clipping is a great solution to that, such is precisely what I have been a proponent of. I was saying precisely that lessening peaks with clipping would result in the need for much less compression as a taming mechanism. Taming obnoxious peaks that result in a high peak value but a low RMS can only be done in so many ways...

    Thanks for the effort, though. Just a bit of a misunderstanding.

    Jeff
     
  8. joeymusicguy

    joeymusicguy Member

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    i have to master everything at -7db rms or my clients complain

    usually never have a problem tho, i guess thats the domain im used to working in
     
  9. CJWall

    CJWall Member

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    okay, mind telling how you get there?
     
  10. smy1

    smy1 Member

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    Maybe his RMS-meter just shows -7 while it really is -9 or -10? I have a lot of inconsistencies between different meters, depending on the length of the sample (as stated earlier in this thread).
     
  11. Slate

    Slate Member

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    -7 is louder then what is standard. The standard average is -9.5 with peak choruses at -8. Its quite easy to go as far as can with clipping to bring a mix to -8.5 and then hit it with a limiter to -7. But does it sound good and have any punch? I doubt it, but joey can prove me wrong by pointing us to a master. Not being an ass, I'm really curious to hear it.
     
  12. nwright

    nwright Member

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    How would most clients know if you don't hit -7?
     
  13. joeymusicguy

    joeymusicguy Member

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    well im not dirty, i tell them what the rms value is

    i get my rms value by opening the song in sound forge, going to statistics, and taking the rms average from there

    it usually reads -7.5 db rms (full scan of song)
     
  14. joeymusicguy

    joeymusicguy Member

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    mix -> ssl gcomp
    ssl gcomp (very light) -> mastering chain

    mastering chain:
    multiband compressor (4 bands) (sometimes i skip this) -> multiband compressor 2
    multiband compressor (3 bands) -> parametric eq
    parametric eq -> transparent limiter
    transparent limiter -> dither
    dither -> export

    and sometimes i add saturation excitement
     
  15. joeymusicguy

    joeymusicguy Member

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    here's a little diddy with no vocals yet, kind of a test mix but i think its good to go for release

    coming out on tribunal records, pretty loud master. havent touched the toms if you're gonna say anything about them, lol...

    http://download.yousendit.com/B58BE1A674D86A3A

    this one's reading -7.9 db rms right now, with little effort
     
  16. sorceron

    sorceron ken

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    as far as i can tell all these clippers are pc only (elephant, timeworks, GCLIP) anyone know of a good mac clipper?
     
  17. JeffTD

    JeffTD Senhor Testiculo

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    Ditto - are there any good Mac clippers?
     
  18. Brett - K A L I S I A

    Brett - K A L I S I A Dreaded Moderator

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  19. TheStoryteller

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    This is the reason I stay with PC... The mac-platform is probably better (although I've NOT had any problems with PC for a few years. not one single program crash or hang), but the software possibilites are so much better with PC. There is ONE exception though... Metric Halo Channelstrip. I want it.
     
  20. Brett - K A L I S I A

    Brett - K A L I S I A Dreaded Moderator

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    The only thing I miss from coming to PC to Mac is this, yes, software possibilities... But overall I'm very happy like this ;)
     

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