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How do you route/bus with many vocal tracks?

Discussion in 'F.O.H.' started by GuitarMaestro, Jun 1, 2007.

  1. AudioPhile777

    AudioPhile777 Mathew Cohen

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  2. James Murphy

    James Murphy Member

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    it's called humor (humour for you UK posters).... i think there's a thread about it over on gearslutz. <*that was a joke too*
     
  3. metalkingdom

    metalkingdom the kinder, gentler me

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    There's a typo in that comment...The "t".

    JUST KIDDING!!!
     
  4. C_F_H_13

    C_F_H_13 Protools Guru

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    Ok well here's my take on this for the Original Poster.:loco:

    Usually I have anywhere from 10-20 vocal tracks. Lead,Lead double,Lead FX Track (whisper,growl etc.) and then a ton of Backgrounds.

    What I do in PT is I setup 2 Aux Busses....1 Mono, 1 Stereo.

    The Mono is for the Lead vocal and it's lead double. The Stereo is for all the none lead vocal tracks.

    I automate all the individual tracks first. Then I automate THE AUXs for overall level in the mix. Then I add compression, EQ if needed, TO THE AUX TRACKS. Unless there is something seriously wrong with the vocal tracks, most of the time they all need just a little hi end and a little filtering. So instead of having 25 Oxford Eq's open..I'll have 2. If there's something wrong with one particular vocal, I'll eq that separately.

    After all that I setup fx sends off these Auxs. Usually Reverb, and 4-6 delays for the lead vocal, and a single reverb for all the BVs, 1-3 minor delays, and sometimes a chorus.

    The only exception to this is distorted vocals. Those go on their own aux as they are alwasy treated differently.

    So at the most I have 3 Aux's which are fed by all the vocals.

    THEN after all that, I setup a VCA so I can do GLOBAL volume changes on all this stuff. Automating is the key for me, so I keep it as organized as possible.

    Hope this is helpful.
     
  5. metalkingdom

    metalkingdom the kinder, gentler me

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    There's no such thing as a VCA in a DAW.
     
  6. James Murphy

    James Murphy Member

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    actually PT has added a new feature with 7.3.1 called "VCA Master", so i'm sure that it's these "virtual" VCA's to which he's referring:

    [​IMG] = [​IMG]

    as you see, VCA can only be assigned to what group they control. you can automate them (volume and volume trim) but the idea is that once you have all your relative automation of individual channels, you then set your groups and just fine-tune your mix balances with just a few VCA masters up. brilliant i think.

    other than inadvertantly bringing out the subject of the new "VCA" Masters in PT (i love this new feature myself) i don't really see much if anything in what CFH has said that's new to the thread. but.. he said it with AUTHORITY. thx, ;)

    :kickass:
     
  7. AudioPhile777

    AudioPhile777 Mathew Cohen

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    buncha fuggin comedians...

    humor through text doesnt translate very well, especially sarcastic humor.

    but I got it... no worries and no need to explain.
     
  8. metalkingdom

    metalkingdom the kinder, gentler me

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    Wow - haven't noticed that yet! Virtual VCA's...cool. I'm assuming the amp noise wasn't included in the virtual version.
     
  9. s34nsm411

    s34nsm411 Member

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    i usually have an instance of autotune and a compressor on each vocal track, and they all feed into a main vocal bus that has eq/reverb/whatever else i want on vox. i use that main vocal bus to automate the vox also
     
  10. metalkingdom

    metalkingdom the kinder, gentler me

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    In essence, he's saying "Don't listen to me". Autotune on each track? Yikes.

    YIKES.
     
  11. s34nsm411

    s34nsm411 Member

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    why wouldnt you? unless im recording some classically trained opera singer or something, autotune adds that little extra sparkle on the vocals and makes the harmonies sound a lot better. you cant just throw autotune on the master vocal bus if thats what youre referring to
     
  12. James Murphy

    James Murphy Member

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    hey s3.., mk is right... you don't wanna be doing that... AT is best, and pretty much always, used as on offline process... just because you can insert it as a real time process does't mean it's a good idea... for many reasons.

    not least of which is that it's a cpu hog.. or that it never works the same every time.. it's going to interpert the same audio differently sometimes....

    the way AT is used by everyone, amatuer and pro alike, and at every level, is as on offline (destructive, AudioSuite, etc... whatever your DAW calls it and/or allows) process whereby you process and permanently change the audio file itself... tuning the vocals just right, then putting the AT away, recovering your CPU power and insuring that your audio will be in tune every time. If you're worried of getting it wrong you just make a duplicate take, hiding the original away in the "takes" or "playlist" menu... and work from a copy.

    if you don't do that, you really, really should start.
     
  13. Genius Gone Insane

    Genius Gone Insane http://www.¯\(°_o)/¯.com

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    Is there an inexpensive version of autotune software?
     
  14. -Gavin-

    -Gavin- Gavornator

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    GVST's GSnap


    The vocal tuning built into Sonar 5PE and above is also fantastic.
     
  15. James Murphy

    James Murphy Member

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    i'm using Melodyne (plug-in version) and i got it cheap because i was registered user of Melodyne Uno, their LE version of the full-fledged Melodyne. the Plug-in version is excellent, so if you got Melodyne Uno as a bundled thing but never used it, like i did, register it and then upgrade to the Plug-in or the full suite.

    the plug-in does everything i need. research the differences and the upgreade program at Celemony's site.
     
  16. C_F_H_13

    C_F_H_13 Protools Guru

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    While I 100% agree in theory and good recording, I have to disagree simply based on experience. I work for a very popular, very succesful production team, and I can tell you we run autotune on every track 98% of the time, whether the singer is amazing or not. HOWEVER, thatt is slowly changing with the Melodyne RTAS plugin you are speaking of....slowly...

    And Metal Kingdom, please be up to date on features before you comment on their non existance :lol: . I was indeed refering to the new VCA feature in PT.
     
  17. James Murphy

    James Murphy Member

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    well i'm talking about what's sensible and common... not the working method of a particular production team... hell i've seen very well known guys doing some pretty silly things that could have been accomplished much more easily. let's stick to what's sensible.... and for the overwhelmingly native/host-based system users on this forum loading an instance of AT and running it live on every vocal track would be a ludicrous method to work by.... and the habits of most users of more powerful systems will bear that out.... at least during mixdown. but hey, if running AT live during tracking works to re-assure everyone that a track is "fixable" and thus good enough to keep... and thus the session moves on more quickly, well then.... werd. :cool:
     
  18. C_F_H_13

    C_F_H_13 Protools Guru

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    See that's a great answer....I was expecting a far harsher response! I tip my hat to you :worship:
     
  19. metalkingdom

    metalkingdom the kinder, gentler me

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    Auto-Tune is gay. It is used a f*ckload, though. At least in pop music. The saddest part is what you're saying about everyone using it...Even really talented singers are lazy these days and will ask for AT. In the producer's chair, I make people sing for real - and in the end they always love the result. Hard work makes for better music. The music biz is just a hustle now. At some point, hopefully, people will rediscover what natural talent sounds like and demand it.

    I've only done a handful of sessions on the latest PT so sorry. And you know what I mean anywayz. :Smug:
     
  20. greyskull

    greyskull Member

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    bang on you yankee cockbag.(yes i AM english) i'm all about spending more time getting a good performance, than a shit one and editing it to make it good, does my head in. but god i love melodyne ;)
     

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