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Discussion in 'In Flames' started by galvanized, Sep 16, 2018.
I liked all of it. Very diverse as you said.
Long live Euge Valovirta (cool last name too, translates into "lightstream")
Ok I haven’t seen The Resistance say that. Got any links? I thought they faded out because they weren’t getting any traction.
For once Slave is pretty much correct.
Hakemo did come out later and say that he regretted his comments and he was bitter at the time, but yeah, it's obvious that Jesper's demons made it impossible to work with him during that time.
One guy talked shit about Jesper then rectified himself at a blabbermouth post.
Some interesting comments from Jesper here as well.
Also gave a comment on ASOP...
It's the production, vocals and lyrics, Jesper. Pretty obvious what the issues are with that album. I was listening to it today, actually, the guitar tone is so fucking weak. If it just had a bit more crunch it would make a lot of the songs so much better. The instrumental side of the album is good, but unfortunately you made it very difficult to appreciate with that shitty mix.
Oh, so THAT is talking shit now.
It's really hard to take anyone seriously, who unironically thinks or agrees that IF should change their name. I understand Jesper, because he understandably bitter about it, just like it's normal to project hate onto the other after a broken relationship. What I don't understand is you, who implies that there is some merit to what he says. And don't tell me you did not imply that because that discussion had been had before to begin with.
Then again, when Jesper badmouths Anders for the 10th time in an extremely childish manner, often not even being brave enough to own up to his own words, it's preaching the truth, but when he is exposed for the unprofessional, depressed alcoholic he is/was/can be, it's talking shit.
Actually I don't really have any strong opinion on In Flames changing their name, I just thought it was interesting that Jesper thinks so. Can't remember him saying so before. If anything the time to say that was after SC, not Battles. Maybe he's thinking in regards to the amount of changes in membership. But then, if the creative force of the band was always Anders/Bjorn/Jesper and only one of those has left... I don't know.
Thing is, IF have had so many changes in style over the past few years that if they were going to change their name it probably should have been after Clayman. Look at the difference between TJR and STYE - it already sounds like a totally different band by that point, let alone by the time they got to Battles.
You know what I mean. I'm not saying that it wasn't true.
When Jesper said that Anders cannot do shit without a producer he's saying the truth but he's talking shit about Anders. That's the kind of thing that I'm talking about.
And it's fine too. Completely uncalled for, extremely childish, but fine.
It's on the level of airing all the dirty laundry of your ex partner of 10+ years. Obviously being together in a close environment for that long will arm you with dozens of stories which can hurt the other one. The difference is that while Anders may had shit-stained boxers, a weird fascination for horse legs and refused to wash the dishes, they are ultimately just stories you can shame the other with out of pettiness, nothing more. None of these are reasons for a relationship to end, especially if you were already together for decades. But Jesper's problem was.
And this is why I dislike whenever Jesper starts talking shit like this. He mentions such petty and non-relevant stuff that it's extremely sad how there not a single person in his life who would give him the love or caring which could free up his mind from being fixated on a made-up arch enemy in Anders.
This band is kinda lame. Or atleast the first album is imo.
I mean everybody is competent and all but majority of their songs lack energy and edge that you would expect from a METAL band. The "old school In Flames" guitar work sounds more like the microwaved leftovers from Jesper Strömblads past.
And can somebody give this Jake E a cigarette or something? He obviously has great technique but his singing feels completely emotionless. It's like a fucking Idols auditioning.
Also what's Valovirtas input in their first album? There's a couple of good moments like the mini solo at 1:30 on Here To Stay and it sounds more like his writing.
It's curious that In Flames fans seem to be the ones who have the biggest problems with Cyhra's debut. Most other people I've spoken to liked it, and pretty much all the reviews are positive. I think a heightened sense of expectation has really blinded a lot of IF fans to what the album is supposed to be. It's fine for what it is. Jake's voice is obviously a sensitive subject for a lot of people too. I think he sounds great, but then I listen to a lot of music with similar vocals so maybe it's just my tastes.
Anyway, the Cyhra debut thread was a while back now let's focus on what's coming up. Sounds like the guitar work is going to be improved for the next album at the very least. I've said before I'd like to see a guest scream/growl vocalist brought in for a couple of tracks, but I get the feeling it isn't likely. It's a shame as I think it's the closest we'd get to hearing an old school IF MDM sounding track again.
He came in after a lot of stuff was already written. His YouTube videos talked about that before. He helped out here and there with riffs and solos. This time I bet he takes even more than half of the writing.
Obviously he is respectful of Jesper and seems to admire his work — he even wears Star Wars shirts just like Jesper. But as soon as Jesper loses his mind or goes into another binge, Euge is positioned to fully take over as a good guy “hero”.
To be fair my problems with Cyhra are pretty much the same problems I have with all the power metal influenced bands.
I just wish Jakes voice was about 20% rougher.
I just googled Euge Valovirta and found out that he actually played for a band called Shining, which is kind of a polar opposite of his positive and energetic presence. For Example their ´wiki page categorizes them as depressive suicidal black metal and I've heard the singer cut himself on stage.
I heard about them because there is ANOTHER band called Shining from Norway. Interestingly they are now known for doing a similar "sellout" move ,in lack of a better word, as In Flames. They started with and album combining Jazzy and very techical metal sound. Now they sound kinda generic radio hard rock. If you want to compare their old and new sound google their first hit single Fisheye(this song rocks so hard) to their newest one called Animals.
This had no point but I found all these connections funny.
Why can’t they ever understand that? It’s so simple to the rest of us. When was the last time you heard an average or better metal band on Metal Blade, Century, Nuclear Blast, Napalm, etc have production as shitty and weird as In Flames after Nordstrom? None! It’s so simple they must purposely be sabotaging their own music. Like at night Anders goes in and randomly resets a bunch of filter settings.
I don’t think there is a single band as ruined by production as In Flames. Even Cyhra’s debut was better and more balanced. And I expect this next one to be even better. It’s not rocket science, stop trying to be weird or different and play your instruments.
Yeah, I get that. IF fans in particular probably weren't expecting the album to have such a power metal tinge. Jesper clearly likes the genre though as he's done stuff with Hammerfall before, and a lot of the guitar harmonies from back in the day could easily fit on a PM record with different production and clean vocals. That said, I think the next Cyhra record will sound quite different to the debut. Jake's vocals will obviously still be there but I think the album will be more energetic. Euge should be able to provide another edge to the music as well.
You hit the nail on the head. It really isn't anything complicated. Jesper can't be deaf to how shit the production is on ASOP. If the album had better production I might even be able to ignore Anders' vocals and lyrics and just appreciate the riffs, leads and melodies. As it stands I have to strain to hear them, and even when I do they don't sound as good as they should because of how shoddy the mixing is. Instrumentally ASOP really isn't that far away from Come Clarity and it's at least as good if not better than STYE. It's really the only album Jesper was involved in that has what I would call very bad production. Reroute, STYE and CC all have their issues, but none of them totally ruin the album. I'd go as far as saying the production really does ruin ASOP. It should be so much better. You have to wonder if Jesper was already checked out at that point and just let it slide. There's no way he could have listened to the final mix with real intent and thought "yep, sounds good". Anybody can tell that it isn't quite right.
Not hearing the mix can't be blamed on one person. Not only there's a producer, there are 5 members as well. They obviously nodded to it.
It's also clear that they wanted to - and still want to - experiment for better or worse. Not a single record has the same mixing as any of those before. Honestly, ASOP's mixing gives me old-school IF vibes, so I wouldn't be surprised if that's what they were going for. In the other thread someone used the word bombastic, and I think R2R, STYE and CC all wanted to sound bombastic, like "THIS will fucking blow you away" - with different methods -, but with ASOP they were like "let's just fucking chill, like back in the day".
I really like how dry it sounds, even if admittedly I am more swooned by those so called bombastic elements. If Move Through Me was made in the STYE era, than the intro would be pulsating with electronics, and if it was in CC, the guitars and drums were tuned up to 11, all of which would give you an impression of "woow". But I'm glad they tried this method once, even if it's clear now that their newer music benefits more from being louder and more in your face.
The thing about asop is: the higher the volume the better it seems to be.
They added layers of guitars with the intention of having a massive sound, and yet, in the final mix, the guitars sound weak.
Well I think STYE could also stand to be improved and Jesper was very involved with that one as far as I know (correct me if I’m wrong though). They got lucky that they were on the upswing. IMO the production did not boost their popularity, that was due to other factors. But they might have attributed their success to that. Maybe they still do. They just take way too many risks with their sound that don’t pay off and even if they did the pay off would have been minimal.
Now on ASOP I could very well see the band telling Jesper essentially “shut up and play — you’re unreliable and don’t get any opinion any more”. Jesper acts like an asshole, band reroutes, Jesper gets more depressed on the margins but is also bound by the golden handcuffs.
Interesting perspective because that’s why I don’t like it. It lacks meat. TJR had a dry lead tone as well but they had reverb and more power. TJR also had meaty rhythm guitar tone. ASOP sounds totally flat for everything. TJR has much more depth. Another thing about TJR is that I can hear every note that each chord is composed of. With ASOP I can’t hear shit and the lead guitars are even keyboard like at times.
I also can’t hear any bass on ASOP except on TCP and even then Peter has no punch through.