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So you want a tight mix?

Discussion in 'F.O.H.' started by jval, Dec 10, 2009.

  1. Zozobra

    Zozobra Member

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    Yeah yeah I know

    Just tought some people might find it interesting to hear them live. Dont think it matters? I understand that. Theres probably even some additional kudos in some peoples eyes for taking a band that cant pull off their songs very cleanly live and making them sound so pristine on record.
     
  2. bryan_kilco

    bryan_kilco Member

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    Hmm....I guess when you're tracking professionally, this sort of stuff is happening more often than not. When I track here at home, I do it by myself...no one rushing me or distracting me. I redo takes until I am happy with what I have. Then, the only editing I usually ever do is getting string noise out of the track and mayyyybe slightly moving stuff around.
     
  3. 006

    006 Member

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    It is interesting. But the fact of the matter is how a band performs live has absolutely nothing to do with the record other than it's the same songs on the record. It may be hard to see it this way, but it really is apples and oranges here.
     
  4. kernelxsanders

    kernelxsanders Bam Bam Boogie Bear!

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  5. Zozobra

    Zozobra Member

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    I see what youre saying, I really do. I'm not argueing it one way or the other on that point.

    I just think that the contrast between their live performance (as seen on the myspace at least) and the studio tracks is pertinent to the discussion. I dont think theres any need to go over exactly why, as its been done to death in this thread (standard of musicianship, writing beyond ability etc). I went through the thread, followed the myspace link, saw that the myspace had videos on it now that hadnt been mentioned in the thread and throught people might like to see that contrast.

    The live sound and the recorded sound have nothing to do with each other. True. I agree. But the live performance quality (or skill level in general) and what you have to do to get the recorded sound have a lot to do with each other.

    Anyway, I wasnt going to say that because like I said its been said and didnt need to be said again, but since you raised the point that the live and record are segregated, thats my rationale for this being interesting - you should still be able to get the results in the studio, but how well the players play affects how you get those results, no? Destinations the same, roads different.
     
  6. fps

    fps Member

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    i'm checking out structures now. the drumming sounds like a drum machine? i'd like the whole thing to flow more, i can imagine live they'd be sensational.
     
  7. CatharsisStudios

    CatharsisStudios trcksngsrpbngs

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  8. drew_drummer

    drew_drummer Dancefap

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    Wasn't keen on Structures.
     
  9. jval

    jval Member

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    Recorded a new song with Structures a few weeks ago. It's better. I don't think they're releasing it but hopefully it leads to label support and a new full length.
     
  10. Mikaël-ange

    Mikaël-ange Member

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    People need to read "Multi-Platinum Pro Tools: Advanced editing techniques to take your projects from good, to gold, and beyond" before speak about it.

     
  11. Auroras

    Auroras Member

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    how do i do this in cubase haha I'm tracking a band thats pretty sloppy
     
  12. koalamo

    koalamo Member

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    I skipped through like 99 percent of the arguing between pages 2 and 13 I just have to say those mixes are killer mann <3 and I'm listening through computer speakers, I can only imagine how good they sound with my monitors plugged in :worship:
     
  13. A Midnight Requiem

    A Midnight Requiem You can call me Adam.

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    I skimmed through the thread, but I didn't read anything about accomplishing this in relation to the band's attitude/willingness. How do you get guitarists to agree to tracking this way? I think a lot of guys would be totally opposed and possibly a little offended at being asked to track in such small pieces (because they can't play it tight enough to sound good).
     
  14. fps

    fps Member

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    i think once you start tracking like this it's no longer music, it's just machines. and no, i don't think it's worth it.
     
  15. DanLights

    DanLights Santa Hat Forever

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    I know this post is really old, but now that it's been bumped more than once, what the hell:

    Are you crazy? Sonically perfect records? I can hear out of tune notes in almost every solo by Omar, and in the latest records vox were recorded in pure improvisation on many ocassions and had to hide out-of-tune vocals with distorsion and other weird effects. I love this band (many people here know this :loco:) and i think they are all super talented musicians, but their music is not tight or super edited in any way
     
  16. steeltormentorx

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    #316 steeltormentorx, Nov 29, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2015
  17. jval

    jval Member

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    There's a certain point where this doesn't really come up. if you have some sort of experience / reputation under your belt you just tell them what to do and they listen. I didn't just start tracking this way overnight, it's a result of doing tons of recording, analyzing the records I like and gradually building / refining techniques to accomplish what I want. If you try to go into the studio tomorrow and decide to make a band track 3 notes at a time, chances are it won't go over well because you won't really know what you're doing. You have to understand what problems you're solving and what problems you need to avoid.

    Of course if it really bugs them - the sound, not the technique - they'll speak up, and you should always listen and move forward accordingly. But 99% of the time they catch on pretty quick and see why you're doing it a certain way. One immediate playback of a finished riff should be enough to put them well at ease.
    I consider this part of being a producer, and guiding their performances in a way that leads to the sound they hired you to deliver. Takes time and lots of practice to get there.
    The degree to which you should "dehumanize" a performance always varies from band to band, player to player, song to song, part to part...

    kinda bums me out to see people reading this thread again and listening to mixes from a year ago. I hate everything that I did even 3 months ago. I agree with everyone saying no, it is not a fantastic mix. But that wasn't really the point of the thread anyways.
     
  18. bryan_kilco

    bryan_kilco Member

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    shit is tight! but how do we always know these tracks arent previously tracked and maybe edited and the dudes just "play along" for the video? either way, a tight player like that is capable of getting tracks done much faster than someone of lesser ability.
     
  19. Arsenu,

    Arsenu, Member

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    to sum things out, i think the whole point in modern metal production is walking the thin line between a dead yet accurate modern sound and flawed yet live and human sound.

    if you ask me thre should be a balance between the 2 different approaches. i think you should track rythem/tight parts the modrn way but live "live" parts alone.
    e.g. solos should be recorded in 1 take wheres accurate rythem parts should be quantized to the 1/64 level.
    for me recording each section seperatly seems enough to keep the music's feeling untouched and when the song is really simple i'll record about 5 full takes at once, layer them, and then edit to perfection. but only in really simple songs...

    anyway, never forget Lez Zeppelin/Metallica/Guns 'N' Roses etc. never had the privilage of punching every 3 notes and are still playing EVERYWHERE and ALL THE TIME
     
  20. SimonTaddio_Qc

    SimonTaddio_Qc Headbanger

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    Because THEY could play their shit tight.
     

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