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Symphony X -Iconoclast

Discussion in 'Seventh Wonder' started by JAGColaço, Feb 2, 2011.

  1. JAGColaço

    JAGColaço A Change Of Seasons

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  2. korruption

    korruption Amateur Dentist

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    I hope it doesn't suck, that's what I think. :D

    Oh wait... "Regarding the sound of "Iconoclast" and how it compares to that of 2007's "Paradise Lost"


    Fuck!!!!!

    Update today: Oh how naive I was!
     
  3. fire_angel

    fire_angel Timboooooo

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    Paradise Lost was amazing, and definitely their most consistent album to date. Don't get me wrong, i LOVE Twilight, Divine Wings and V, but PL is the only one i still listen to religiously.
     
  4. Frankgate

    Frankgate Member

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    better late than never...... or maybe I should say "better never than late"

    Hope it's much better than poor PL.
     
  5. Detective Clarence Beauregard

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    While I love Paradise Lost, I do yearn for the return of more keyboard in the mix. With PL, the mix was very good aside from the keys (the bass tone was incredible). But what about the heavy-keyboarded sound of epics like Church of the Machine, Through the Looking Glass, Divine Wings of Tragedy, Candlelight Fantasia, Communion and the Oracle, Rediscovery, Accolade II, Awakenings, The Odyssey, etc? That's the Symphony X I love. Sure, Domination was bad ass and The Walls of Babylon was heavy as hell, but with Russ singing so gruff I feel that a lot of the emotion featured on previous albums was lost. I miss the feel of all the polyrhythms with the keys playing in one time signature and the bass/guitar in another, but the sound always grooving (unlike most other prog metal, which sounds forced and choppy).

    That said, I'm sure I'll love Iconoclast anyway. The theme of the album seems a bit odd for Symphony X, though; they rarely stray from mythology as a lyrical theme.
     
  6. Frankgate

    Frankgate Member

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    the SyX I prefer are TDWOT's, I hope there'll be more melodies, instead of Russell's roars
     
  7. korruption

    korruption Amateur Dentist

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    Nicely spoken! See this is why I hated Paradise Lost. Where was Russell's amazing and emotional singing? While I'm for vocalists shouting their nuts off, it's not what I liked about Symphony X. Everything they did up to PL was great and each album had it's own identity.

    Looks like they're taking a few notes from Burton C. Bell also: "Iconoclast"? (Ascension of the Watchers' EP), man vs. machine? Sounds like most Fear Factory albums. So now that I got those similarities out of the way...

    Paraside Lost's title track was a terrible letdown, cause the chorus just sounded very dull and up to when I heard it I felt it could have compared with The Accolade, but then it sounded to me like Russell's practically falling asleep.

    As for the second ballad, The Sacrifice, I thought it sounded great... until the chorus (yes, I focus a lot on choruses :D)... So now it's the exact opposite but in a worse way. Russ is just screaming himself purple and it's totally unnecessary and it killed the song completely for me.

    I didn't like Jen Bogren's production either. It also plagued other albums which he mixed - both of Saint Deamon's albums, and Aspera's "Ripples".

    I will be fair and say that "Set the World on Fire" and "Walls of Babylon" were awesome though. :)

    Also I agree fully with the nearly non-existent keys.
     
  8. GLDF

    GLDF New Metal Member

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    I also do miss a lot of things from the old SX. Thou I do think Paradise Lost is a strong album. Thou, I can't listen to it over and over again like I can with the older albums.

    Oculus Ex Inferni and Set The World On Fire are great "Kick in your face" songs. Just what an opening song for an album should be.

    The bigger problems with the album is that it's too focused on just being metal and heavy as hell. Thou, I'm a metalhead so, obviously that works as well if it's done well. And Domination happens to work really well also. The album itself is rich on badass riffs (Thou I also agree on what you guys said about the keys on the album). Cause the album would be much better if it was less guitar oriented. The older albums had a better balance between all the instruments. This whole "Getting heavier with time" seems to be very common in the world of progressive metal. But I actually like it, I would never want Dream Theater to go back in time. And I'm a HUGE fan of their old albums and I like pretty much everything they've done, except some lame songs 'cause of the pressure in 97. But still, I find the new Dream Theater to be amazingly powerful and epic as hell. Oh well, we're talking about SX here.

    But the rest of the songs on Paradise Lost are very simiular. They're all saved because of the "Good Guitar Riffs". But the album lacks of variation.
    Thou, still, I do think it's a good album with many strong tracks. I don't listen to a progressive band if I don't want to progress along with the band. I can only hope that they're gonna progress into making the music more progressive and more variated this time. Thou, if it's a Paradise Lost #2, I'm still looking forward to it.
     
  9. Lunrob

    Lunrob Member

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    Looking at their tour schedule, I see a possibility to go on an European summer festival tour, and hopefully taking a stop at Sweden Rock in June. :) Let's all cross our fingers!
     
  10. keeperxiii

    keeperxiii Awakening...

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    I second that, but the theme seems fitting for SX. If anything, I'm happy that they're trying to come up with something new and original. I'm still yearning for a concept like Somewhere out in Space (Gamma Ray) though.
     
  11. Detective Clarence Beauregard

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    I completely agree with this. If you played me a 5-second clip of any Symphony X song, I could tell you which album it's from based on the production and overall tone.

    I thought the instruments (sans keyboard) were mixed well relative to each other (you could actually hear the bass), but overall the album was simply too loud. I guess it's a new trend in metal music or something; I know very little about mixing.

    Babylon is one of my favorite Symphony X songs; one of the highlights of the album for sure!

    It's not only that they're turned down, but also that there simply aren't as many stand-out parts. In songs like Domination, Set the World on Fire, Serpent's Kiss, Walls of Babylon, etc., Pinnella just doubles a lot of what Romeo is playing with a synth patch. If I want to listen to Dream Theater, I'll listen to Dream Theater. I miss the melodic piano lines with polyrhythmic chugging guitar and bass underneath, like in the "old" Symphony X days.

    Exactly! Romeo's guitar on the first five albums never overshadowed any of the other instruments; on the last two he cranked it (although it isn't as bad as most metal bands). The one thing I love about Symphony X is that they're like a symphony in that all instruments come through in the mix; no one instrument steals the show (aside from solos). Almost every other metal band is guitar this, guitar that. Even as a guitar player I find that boring and selfish. Michael Romeo knows when not to play; examples are scattered throughout all their more melodic, progressive songs; Communion and the Oracle and Through the Looking Glass come to mind.

    I respect Seventh Wonder for this same reason; every instrument is 20% of the sound.
     
  12. mad_taffer

    mad_taffer Member

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    At first I was also put off by Allen's "rough" vocals, but given the subject matter I think it fits thematically as part of the overall production. I'm kind of on the outs with other Symphony X fans though on what I like from the band. To me Paradise Lost gave their sound a much needed "tightening". I do not like The Divine Wings of Tragedy as to me it actually feels like 24 minutes. Whereas The Great Escape just flows for me with never a dull moment. I can also say the same thing for Through the Looking Glass, although I love the chorus, it takes forever to get there, I will literally forget i'm listening and zone out. But stuff like Revelations and Eve of Seduction off of Paradise Lost keep me locked in the entire time. I am not a fan of Serpent's Kiss though, as it seems to be just 80's metal all over again. In fact I think the middle section of Revelation is probably one of my favorite instrumentals as it's extremely exciting and gets your blood pumping. I know I have a different take, but it's just the way I interpret the band I guess.
     
  13. Detective Clarence Beauregard

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    I feel that Symphony X has always been "tight," but I agree that Paradise Lost was tighter.

    Interesting. Perhaps it's because Divine Wings doesn't have a lot of vocals when compared to The Great Escape? Divine Wings is probably my favorite song of all time, so I might be a little biased...

    I will agree with you to a degree on this; the song does drag on a bit. The solo section in particular seems to function only to unnecessarily elongate the song, which can be annoying. However, the first five minutes or so of the song I find to be amongst the band's finest work.

    To be fair, those songs are quite a bit shorter than the ones previously listed...

    I like the song, but it's certainly one of the weaker tunes from Paradise Lost. This song, not unlike Eve of Seduction, has some very strange tonalities for Symphony X.

    Agreed. One of the best songs on the album for sure, and only one of three to feature a keyboard solo! Also, the fact that it's a prequel to Divine Wings doesn't hurt for me...
     
  14. RuRoRul

    RuRoRul Member

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    Same here in that Paradise Lost is probably my favourite album, along with V.

    I don't think I'm as extreme as you in my views since those two songs are among my favourite of Symphony X, but I will agree that I don't see why everyone is so anxsious for them to go back to their DWOT days (album as well as title track). The track does drag a bit, mainly because of the instrumental section I'd have to say, like whatDetective Clarence Beauregard said. I'm not one to complain about long instrumentals but there's a bit in the second half of that track which I feel goes on too long for what it is. From about halfway through up until the ending (which is amazing) I don't think it's got enough to remain fully interesting. And I've never had a problem with Through The Looking Glass's length but I'd agree it seems to take a while to get into it.

    Just happens to be my three favourite from that album as well :headbang:

    I actually really like Serpent's Kiss though. At first I found it one of the weaker tracks, but I've come to appreciate it more than most of the others, probably. I just think it's got a great riff.

    The instrumental is probably the main reason Revelation is one of my favourite Symphony X songs, perhaps even my absolute favourite.

    Anyway, for this album I'm not too thrilled about the vocals. I'm fine with it being similar to Paradise Lost, even if I'd prefer a higher ratio of Revelation / Paradise Lost to Domination and Serpent's Kiss. But even I can understand people saying Paradise Lost doesn't have enough of Allen's cleaner singing, even though it wasn't a problem for me since I only discovered them a year or so ago so had their entire discography to go through.

    I'm just pleased to finally hear something concrete about this album though.
     
  15. mad_taffer

    mad_taffer Member

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    Detective and RuRoRul, thank you for making me not feel quite so alone in my thinking. :)
    I am looking forward to the new album. As with Paradise Lost, I will not mind the aggressive singing if it fits the mood of the song or theme of the album.
     
  16. JAGColaço

    JAGColaço A Change Of Seasons

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    Now something a little bit different... Can't wait to hear this new project... two masters of (prog) metal together:

    "VERY excited about a new project I'm working on w one my fav singers in the world: my bro Sir Russell Allen...wait til you hear this sh*t!!!" (Tweeted by M.Portnoy)

    F*ck YEAH! =D
     
  17. jakethesnake

    jakethesnake New Metal Member

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    Hmm, Russ stating that Iconoclast will be way more intense than Paradise Lost, and that it'll contain much more heavy riffage and harsh vocals, can only mean we'll see less of Mike Pinnella's epic keyboard moments...*sigh*
     
  18. MarkBarron

    MarkBarron Audassy Frontman

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    Dude, you don't know that! Keyboards can be very heavy and intense, if done right. Michael Pinnella can do it!!
     
  19. jakethesnake

    jakethesnake New Metal Member

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    Yeah that's true, though I said that because I can't hear that much keys on PL - although there are great moments like the title track and Domination, there's much less keys on that album than the other ones...

    Anyhow, it will be a legendary album nonetheless, keys or not...this is Symphony X we're talking about :worship:
     
  20. JAGColaço

    JAGColaço A Change Of Seasons

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    A brand new song from Iconoclast, "End of Innocence", on February 25th



    The vocal melodies sounds very nice!
     
    #20 JAGColaço, Feb 28, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2015

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