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What mids are good to scoop?

Discussion in 'F.O.H.' started by SirLucasTheGreat, Feb 10, 2009.

  1. SirLucasTheGreat

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    What mids are good to scoop in post-eq? there are definitely some which are essential to the clarity of the guitar but then some that can be sacrificed to beefen up the tone. Are there any general frequencies that you guys have found for this purpose?
     
  2. Metaltastic

    Metaltastic Member

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    The ones that are excessive in a particular tone ;) But to give a less shitheaded answer, I would say the ones that have really been giving me grief with my Mesa Stiletto cab (hopefully won't be as much of an issue when I sell it for a Recto OS cab!) are around the range of 400 Hz that I dub the "wooly" mids. Not muddy, that's more 200-300, and not honky, that's more ~700 (not coincidentally where the Tube Screamer has it's mid hump, occasionally it's too much for me). So yeah, generally I cut like 3-4 dB at 400, and ~2 dB at around 700 if the Tube Screamer "cocked wah" sound is too much (and it's always better to cut with a narrow Q value, I usually have it at around .25)
     
  3. ahjteam

    ahjteam Anssi Tenhunen

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    I cut the ones that sound bad. The exact frequencies depend on many variables. A spectrum analyzer (like Voxengo SPAN for VST and Arizona AudioXplorer for AU) helps to determine the exact frequencies
     
  4. LSD-Studio

    LSD-Studio HCAF crusher

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    If I have to cut mix in post EQ I'll reamp and change the mic-position&amp settings etc
     
  5. Morgan C

    Morgan C MAX LOUD PRESETS¯\(°_o)/¯

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    There are NO frequencies that are always good to scoop or boost or whatever. The best thing to do is to record your amp (or modeller or whatever you use), then compare it with a tone you like and play with the EQ. It is better to use a little EQ as possible on gtrs but this will help you determine what frequencies are good/bad. Use charts that say 'this range of frequency = honk, etc.' to begin with but you'll learn quickly. I've been doing this on and off for about a year and I can tell, just by listening, where 500Hz on a guitar is compared to 300Hz or compared to 1kHz, so I know immediately what range I'm looking in to boost/scoop. I'm sure the more experienced people will be able to tell with even greater detail. But once you start to learn this, you can compare to reference tones, and listen in different environments and be able to edit your guitar tone much easier.
     
  6. PhilR

    PhilR Studio Scapegoat

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    I'll often pull a couple of db around 240hz to clean up any mud and boost around 2.5k but not more than that usually. We're set up to have the head in the control room now so we can tweak the sound on the amp before tracking.
     
  7. Fox Mulder

    Fox Mulder The Truth Is Out There

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    Very good tips, but really - depends on the song and/or genre (subgenre of metal, to be precise:heh:)

    Personally, I don't believe in rules. Whatever you can get and like is what matters here.

    Cheers!:heh:
     
  8. paladin shredder

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    If you're truly metal, you scoop out ALL OF THEM! :headbang::headbang::headbang:

    Actually, for thrash metal stuff scooping out 600hz works really well.
     
  9. sgt.pepper

    sgt.pepper Member

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    Do you take out all the mids on the amp allready in the recording session?
     
  10. RKelly

    RKelly Metal?

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    Scoop everything from 400Hz to 4 kHz.


    Nothing important there...
     
  11. Sean in Silence

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    ^^^^^^
    I hope that's sarcasm
    hahahahaha
    Otherwise I would have to question how much experience you actually have with eqing guitars
    or for that matter, eq in general
    lol
     
  12. Metaltastic

    Metaltastic Member

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    Haha, yeah, I'd say it's sarcasm, seeing as how he specified literally the entire midrange ;)
     
  13. Sean in Silence

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    that's what I figured
    hahaha
    but some of the posts on this forum......
    like the "How do mix drums" thread make me wonder.....
    hahaha
     
  14. Melodeath

    Melodeath Moonbow

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    ¯\(°_o)/¯
     
  15. FourFour

    FourFour 4/4

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    lol wth? ¯\(°_o)/¯ this shrugging guy is spreading.

    Anyways, I like to cut a little bit at 400hz and 200hz.

    400hz for the slightly scooped sound and 200hz when the guitars are too thick.
     
  16. jacare

    jacare Member

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    Let's say I HATE 2.5K :mad:
    But that's just me... ¯\(°_o)/¯
     
  17. sgt.pepper

    sgt.pepper Member

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    Hey, i found this amp settings by andy on the net:

    5150 settings:
    amp settings are pre gain 2: 6
    bass: 7
    mid: 0
    treble: 5.5
    post gain 2: 5
    resonance: 7
    presence: 7.5

    Why does he takes out all the mids?

    I thought they are important for that guitar sound (especially the lower ones?)

    Thanks for the answer!
     
  18. Metaltastic

    Metaltastic Member

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    It's all relative, since the 5150 is a SUPER middy amp to begin with (and also, I don't find the tone controls on it to be particularly powerful)
     
  19. Splat88

    Splat88 Member

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    These are not Andy's settings. This is from the article you're referencing. Read a little more carefully below:




    5150 settings:
    amp settings are pre gain 2: 6
    bass: 7
    mid: 0
    treble: 5.5
    post gain 2: 5
    resonance: 7
    presence: 7.5

    your in the right area, I'd maybe have a bit more of the mids in there, I'm presuming your on the lead channel there. You're probably over complicating things, especially using the 1960 cab, that's going to phase things up quite nicely (in a bad way). Try 1 Sm57 (not beta) at the centre of cone, an inch away from the grill cloth. Try this on each speaker, then compare, find your favourite speaker, then move it about an inch -if that, off centre to try and get rid of that high 10k fizz, maybe filter 60hz down and 12 k upwards out. If it's sounds great in the room, it has to be something your doing later. Nothing drastic was done to the EC gtrs in the mix. I think we used the rhythm channel though, with Tube Screamer, though that doesnt sound like the problem, as I use the lead channel also some times.

    With your gtrs filter from 60/80 hz down and also from 12 k up, see if that helps.

    Here's a 5150 mark 1 setting by Andy Sneap:

    Lead channel
    Pre 11 oclock
    Low 1 oclock ish
    Mid 9 oclock ish
    High 11.30ish
    Post 9.30, 10 oclock
    Res 2 oclock
    Pres 3 o clock

    Tube screamer
    Drive 9 oclock
    Tone 11 oclock
    Level 12 o clock


    http://noise101.wikidot.com/pro-tips#toc2
     
  20. sgt.pepper

    sgt.pepper Member

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    okay, okay...thanks for the info ;)

    But..."Mids 9 oclock ish" is also not that much how i think!?

    Or is this more or less agood starting point for modern metal guitars?

    To much mids would give me maybe a more Dimebag Sound?


    Sorry if this sounds stupid!
     

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