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Discussion in 'Novembers Doom' started by turnloosetheswans, Aug 13, 2004.
the cure was christ...if ya missed im very very sorry....i couldnt have been any happier
I saw them. I enjoyed it. Unfortunately I missed the entire second stage and I was really hoping to check out Auf Der Mar. But Mogwai and The Cure were good. The Rapture sucked. Interpol... though I like their album I wasn't to much into their live set.
But I thought The Cure were spot on delightful, though I wasn't too much into their set list.
It should have been Rapture from Finland. Now THAT would have been amazing. The Cure and uh... good Rapture.
this rapture isnt so bad either...i seen em before and i was pretty ok by them... i dunno...maybe the venue was too big for what they were trying to do..they are pretty arthouse sorta stuff.... and do ya think novembers doom gets this sorta disertation on the rapture's webboard????
wooo...agreed, dan. Finland's Rapture is a fine band. i was really big into them for awhile, but i dunno.....they got a bit same-y for me. theyre not one of those bands that i could listen to all the time, but come to think of it, ive given their cds a rest for quite awhile. actually, my copy of Songs for Withering seems to be MIA.....=/
I'll sell it back to you for $10
Yeah, I agree. Both of their cd's tire quickly. But man! The first few times I listened to Songs for the Withering, I was floored. They need a new album, like yesterday.
I almost bought a Rapture cd the other day at a local record shop, but I wasn't sure what they sounded like. I hear (after the fact) that they are akin to mid-period Katatonia, is this true?? And what, if anything at all, do you guys think about Type-o-Negative, and Moonspell?
I think that Rapture is somewhat similar to mid-paced Katatonia in ways, sure. I haven't listened to Rapture as much as Jess has, but what I have heard I enjoyed. Basically if you're into Katatonia, Opeth, October Tide, etc., then Rapture are at least worth checking out. They deserve more credit than they get, in my opinion.
As for Type O and Moonspell, I'm a big fan of both bands. My favorite Type O cd is "October Rust", though I like them all. I look forward to seeing them in October with Amorphis (now there's a tour I'd be happy to see us open for!)
Moonspell, I think, are a band that keep getting better and better with each album. I think "The Antidote" was one of the best albums of last year. They're also really really cool people who've become friends of ours over the years, and Fernando has been supportive of us, so he's okay in my book. Plus he turned me onto listening to ROOT, which is fast becoming a favorite of mine.
It'd be great if someday we could tour together with Moonspell, actually. I think it'd be a fitting package and we'd be honored to do it. Here's hoping...
Did Big Boss from Root ever appear on a Moonspell disc? He said he would in exchange for Fernando's bit on Black Seal, but I haven't seen any sign that he did.
And speaking of ROOT, have you heard Madness of the Graves yet? I'm not so sure about it musically. It feels like a step backwards into more typical Metal realms. Big Boss doesn't exactly use the full range in display on the two previous albums either. However, a large part of his appeal to me comes from the fact that he's one of the most intelligent people to write in the Satanic and/or mystical lyrical realm and I'm still absorbing that aspect of the disc.
(sorry. It's bloody impossible for me to find other ROOT fans not of my creation in these parts so I get kind of gabby on the subject.)
So Lar... bearing in mind that I like Fernando's guest spot on that disc, the butterfly effect, several moments of Sin/Pecado, and Moonspell's live performance where would you say I should go next in my exploration of their catalog? I keep getting told "WOLFHEART OMGOMGOMG" but I'm not sure. It sounds like that's the "raw & tr00" moment but sometimes, I think I've got enough tr00 br00tality.
You know what REALLY disap
And on a side note... apparently Amorphis' singer just left. They've got a stand in (the black league guy I think) for some touring. But overall... how much of an impact do you think that's going to have?
not related at all but i buy alot of records and i got 2 that ya all neeeeeeed to check out....and this isnt rune stuff cuz i kinda figured alot of ya may not like that aaaaaaaaaaaand ya need to see them live...
hammers of misfortune-the august engine is genius!!!!! its a conglom of a ton of different and amazing stuff.... www.hammersofmisfortune.com
void of silence - human antithesis is a piece of christ too....totally awesome atmospheric doom with aa from primoridal on vocals...
try these out...theirs mp3's on both sights...and i think ya will be happy...and man ya should love rune
Yes Hammers of Misfortune are awesome! And a Type O show in Chicago on Halloween oh Hell yeah!!! Oh yeah to make this about November's Doom I first heard them when I picked up " Of Stone Flowers and Sculptered Ivy" used and other than the first minute My Dying Bride "homage" thought it was one of the best cd's I had heard in a long time
I didn't really care for Moonspells' "Wolfheart". But then again, a former friend of mine burned me out on Black Metal. And I do agree that they are getting better w/ each record. As for Type-o, I have all their stuff and love it all, even Petes' pre-TON material in Carnivore and Retalliation.
But they don't come close to kicking the amount of ass that Novembers Doom do.
Just out of curiosity, is anyone else here just as gut sick of Black Metal as I am?
Um... Retaliation is the name of a Carnivore album.
"Jesus Hitler, Adolf Christ.
Is this the second coming?
Or the Fourth Reich?"
Actually they are two different bands. Carnivore was a Metal band, where as Retaliation was a hardcore band. After the folding of Retaliation, Pete and Kenny formed Sub-Zero, which later turned into Type-O-Negative!
Regardless, its very good stuff.
On the whole "Retaliation" subject, I thought in actuality it was "Repulsion", which they then had to change due to the existence of the other (now legendary) Repulsion....I only had heard of "Retaliation" in terms of being the 2nd Carnivore album title, not as a band name, but maybe you're right.....
And for the record, though this subject has been addressed to death in the past, that whole "homage" to My Dying Bride at the beginning of "With Rue And Fire" wasn't an homage at all, nor was it intentional in any way. It was written by Eric Burnley who, if I recall correctly, hadn't ever even heard the MDB song it resembled when he wrote it. It was a complete accident. The similarity didn't even occur to the rest of the band until some time after the song was finished. Andy from MDB thought it was cool and it became a bit of a joke between he and us, actually. So no disrespect to MDB whatsoever, but in truth, it was an accident and not meant as any sort of homage or nod to MDB at all.
And for that matter, in slight coincidence as to what this thread was initially about, that same beginning of "With Rue and Fire" is also the same first four notes as the beginning of "Killing An Arab" by The Cure. Kinda almost wish more people would make that comparison at this point!
It's easy to get burnt out on music that sounds similar enough to be considered part of a genre normally. Then you have something like Black Metal where it's "vital" to adhere to earlier blueprints. It allows the bands more time to put on makeup and take photos in the forest, but the music isn't always exciting.
That said, I'm not completely burnt out on Black Metal. Portions ridiculously raw stuff can be exihilirating and a few of the arty bands had some really great ideas. Still, I've got no use for the majority of the clones out there.
Are those really the same notes? It doesn't help that my ears are horrible. Certainly doesn't help when I'm trying to learn guitar. Also I didn't mean to give any offense, but frankly I didn't really care as soon as the rest of the CD kicked in. As I listened to it more, that first minute didn't stick out anymore, melding with the atmosphere of the entire album so to speak.
I think the order of Band names was Sub-Zero (taken by another band,) then Repulsion (taken by another band,) then Carnivore, then Type O Negative.
Actually it is basically the same notes, though the Cure's are an octave higher. It might not be the exact same key, but its close, and the pattern is the same. When I first joined the band and heard "With Rue and Fire", "Killing An Arab" was what came to mind first. I hadn't heard "Sear Me" for several years at that point and it never even occured to me about the similarity until some time later.
I'm not really getting defensive about the whole matter, it's just that we have caught alot of flak from people about that whole bit in the past. Considering that bands play riffs that are similar to other band's riffs all the time, I always thought it was silly that people gave us so much heat for it, but I think it's because some people just really wanted to find a reason to dislike us and write us off as "MDB clones". On certain other message boards, I've read where people have called us exactly that, but meanwhile, they admit to having only heard one cd of ours, or a handful of songs of ours at best. Anyone who really knows ND realises that we've changed alot over the years and that each album is somewhat different from the other, you can't really judge us or categorize us after hearing only one song, or even one cd. Thankfully people like yourself gave the rest of the music a listen, even after you initially had the "MDB homage" vibe, and realised there was much more going on than that.
I always find it pretty interesting when people try to throw bands into certain categories and label them when only hearing small portions of their music. There's so many bands that are just impossible to judge and "figure out" so to speak, from hearing only one or two songs. Can you imagine if Opeth were to be judged solely upon listening to "Harvest"? Or for that matter, the entire "Damnation" album? Bands like Katatonia, Anathema, Amorphis, Agalloch, and a band such as us, just cannot be judged and labelled based on hearing a few songs here and there, nor upon hearing only one cd from the entire catalog. Sorry if I'm ranting, but it's just always been something that's stuck out to me when reading different threads and forums and seeing people's comments and reactions regarding this matter. I just wonder how many people have potentially missed out on hearing some really killer music, because they heard one or two songs and mistakenly presumed that it was a full representation of that bands repertoire.
And, as for the ongoing Peter Steele debate lol......I think Repulsion was the name that Pete chose AFTER Carnivore had split. I believe I even have an article or two about them when they were called Repulsion, and that would have been the early 90's. It was then that they learned that the other Repulsion existed and so Pete chose Type O Negative as a new name. I'm basing most of this on memory alone, so I might be wrong.
The chief similarity between ND and MDB that I've noticed is that the former has "doom" in their name and the latter is considered a major part of Doom-Metal. Other than that... I chalk the comparisons up to lazy criticism. Some of it's probably well intentioned. Drop the MDB name and a sizable number of people will check it out. Even then, some will listen hoping for things that just aren't there.
Others use the MDB shit to try and degrade bands. If you're seen as similar to or influenced by them, your material is weak and unworthy to be considered part of the same genre as almighty Solstice, Candlemass, Skepticism, or Thergothon. That's the problem with evolving I guess. You once played Doom Metal and will be critiqued as if you still do. (Which is not to say you completely don't. There are still traces of years spent listening to Winter and Trouble in there but the sound's expanded more than a twee bit.)
DAMMNIT! I'M GOD!! I KNOW EVERYTHING LISTEN TO ME!!!lol!!! :hotjump:
Well, ok thats a flagrant lie, but it sounds neat doesn't it!?!
To FINALLY! put an end to the whole Type-o thing (and yes this is actually very funny to me that we're on the ND message board and arguing about TON)
Here's the time line - Fallout, Carnivore, Retaliation, Sub-Zero, Type-O-Negative!!!! in a nut shell, pete steele was really the only constant, w/ josh being in fallout and if memory serves, Kenny joing retaliation around the time of their demise, w/ josh rejoing the two in sub-zero and later TON.
Good ol' message board banter!!!!!!