This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.

Welcome to Our Community

Wanting to join the rest of our members? Feel free to sign up today.

16:9 Widescreen?

Discussion in 'Evergrey' started by Snowmaker, Jun 6, 2005.

  1. sknight

    sknight Are You Morbid?

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Messages:
    1,233
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    LI, NY-The center of heavy metal and SUVs
    Nope, which is why the threads should be stickied. Personally, I'm always skeptical of a record company, especially when they have not made their own announcement.
     
  2. sknight

    sknight Are You Morbid?

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Messages:
    1,233
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    LI, NY-The center of heavy metal and SUVs
    I posted a message on the other thread on the I/O forum. It's been close to a month with no word, so perhaps chime in over there again.
     
  3. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    I just did. My expectations aren't high that they are willing to do anything, they've known about it and still have made no effort to acknowledge the flaw.

    Maybe they'll prove me wrong, but it's not looking good for us.
     
  4. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
    I was thinking the same thing.
     
  5. BlindPanzer

    BlindPanzer Iced Guardian was taken:)

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2004
    Messages:
    1,054
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Miami
    Is there anything else we as customers to InsideOut's product can do to speed up the process, if any, to get a disc replaced? It just really irritates me that the company is selling something that is subpar and not meeting the expectations of the fans and the band. The reason why the band spent money to record this concert in high definition is to WATCH THE DAMN THING IN HIGH DEFINITION, not a stretched out aspect ratio. Sorry if I'm just rambling, but I'm a pissed off consumer right about now, and I wish there was something I COULD do.
     
  6. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
    Its not in hi-def. High definition DVDs are not out yet.
     
  7. SliderJeff

    SliderJeff Got any tacquitos?

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    98
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    I haven't quite got through all the liner notes yet, but I am not certain that this was filmed in HI-Def and then downrezzed to 480p for the DVD release. Best guess is that they either used 480p digital cameras shooting in 16:9, or just used normal film camera shooting 16:9 and then encoded to 480p in an A/D step.

    Here's my gripe... and something that HOPEFULLY will get resolved if/when they reauthor the discs correctly. How many people watch this DVD on a screen larger than your average computer monitor? I'd venture to say a good portion, right? If you spend the kind of money that EG did on this DVD... why in the bloody blue blazes of hell are there so many jaggies on virtually every frame of the video???? Check out Jonas cymbals in nearly any shot. THey appear to be made out of legos with the stair stepping that is apparent on the edges. This completely ruins the time and effort and MONEY that EG spent on filming the thing in the first place. I can only assume that one of two things happened:

    1.) The person authoring the DVD purposefully used such a low bitrate on the video that the MPEG-2 compression artifacts took whatever decent resolution the source material had and chucked it out the window. This MIGHT have been done to squeeze all of the material on a single dual density DVD. That being said, according to my estimates, there are 3GB LEFT on this DVD. This is space that COULD have been used to heighten the video bitrate, easily. But honestly, how many people would bitch if they just split the full show across two discs and encoded it at a nice kickass Superbit DVD type rate?


    2.) The person doing the authoring had no clue what to set the MPEG-2 Encoder's values to and just went with some sort of default. It'd be interesting to see which Pro Encoder was used. THere are a handful of de facto standards used for pro encoding, Canopia's Procoder, Mainconcept's encoder, the Sonic one... can't recall the name.

    Anyway, at least the audio sounds great... but the God awful artifacts on a 56" DLP from a Denon DVI DVD player are just unreal for a pro product. I can only imagine that the author never watched this DVD on a screen larger than their computer monitor or these horrendous artifacts would be glaringly obvious.

    Are you listening Inside Out? Or perhaps Revolver Studios?

    Re-author the darn thing and do it RIGHT so that EG (and their fans) can get there hard earned money's worth.

    Regs,
    Jeff
     
  8. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    If the aspect ratio was set correctly then I don't believe the stair-stepping would be so blatently obvious. Since it's anamorphic widescreen, I believe the video size is actually 720x360 but stretched to 720x480 for display which is going to cause MPEG artifacts to really stick out.

    I did a preliminary look on the computer when I changed it from 4:3 to 16:9 and it looked better but I didn't check it out on the television. I was just verifying that the aspect ratio was the problem.

    I agree with you about the extra 3 Gig, it would have been nice if they used all the room on the disc to maximize quality. I doubt they'll change it now because the fix is simple, it's just the re-distribution that's going to be the problem.
     
  9. SliderJeff

    SliderJeff Got any tacquitos?

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    98
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Well, here's the thing. They need to re-author it anyway to fix the 4:3 flag. It takes roughly 90 minutes to render an hour of straight digital video (as AVI) to an mpeg-2 file. Then around another hour or so to author the mpeg-2 to DVD. I'll go out on a limb and assume that they already have one giant video file that gets authored to disc. It's friggin simple to tweak the knobs and dial in better compression ratios... even on an Avid system or something along those lines... so if they are going to kill 3-4 hours just fixing the flag issue... why not kill an extra 2 or 4 hours and re-encode it as well? I mean, this type of things takes me roughly the times I listed above on a Pentium 4 2.4Ghz. I have to believe that have at LEAST that quality of a machine to author on. Maybe even something like a G5 streamlined for video production.

    Either way... it's not like we're talking added weeks to re-author correctly... we're talking hours here.

    Oh well... when it comes right down to it, my faith in there even addressing the 4:3 flag is slowly being ground into a fine powder.

    Regs,
    Jeff
     
  10. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    It would be nice but I don't see them doing the whole MPEG2 encode over again. They'll just re-author the DVD and call it done.

    MetalAges got my hopes back up. We'll see what happens.
     
  11. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
  12. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    That's kind of hard, what about just posting a link in there to this forum and let them know there's an ongoing discussion happening here??
     
  13. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
    Copy & Paste.
     
  14. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    I don't think a copy and paste of a discussion will work, with replies interwoven between comments. I'll just post a link to this discussion. It'll be easier and less confusing....IMO.
     
  15. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
    I just meant your one big post.

    Ah, forget it! :loco:
     
  16. RockGarden

    RockGarden Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2005
    Messages:
    39
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL
    Sorry 'bout that, I thought you meant the whole conversation. I couldn't figure out how to do it to where it would make sense to everyone so I just posted the link.
     
  17. sknight

    sknight Are You Morbid?

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2003
    Messages:
    1,233
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    LI, NY-The center of heavy metal and SUVs
    Still waiting, with no word.
     
  18. Snowmaker

    Snowmaker GO BLUE!!

    Joined:
    May 13, 2002
    Messages:
    1,212
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    New Baltimore, Michigan
    Still waiting ....
     
  19. esa

    esa Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2003
    Messages:
    560
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Agreed: video quality of the NTSC version is very good on a large home theater display, except for the jaggies -- even after fixing the aspect ratio flag using an IFO editor and DVD Shrink. What a shame: this is one of the very best concert DVDs out there as far as video, audio, surround mix, lighting, editing, and capturing the concert atmosphere.

    Can anyone with a large display confirm that the PAL discs are free from jaggies (staircase artifacts) -- watch edges of guitar necks?
     
  20. SliderJeff

    SliderJeff Got any tacquitos?

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    98
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Watch the outlines of all the cymbals in the drumkit as well. Jaggies are easily seen every time the camera behind the drums shows the kit and the crowd.

    Still waiting for a resolution... no pun intended :)
    Jeff
     

Share This Page