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Burzum- Hvis lyset tar oss

Discussion in 'Your Reviews' started by Laeth MacLaurie, Dec 15, 2005.

  1. Laeth MacLaurie

    Laeth MacLaurie New Metal Member

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    Theoretically I suppose, but all of his music is essentially soundtrack music, both in feel and basic approach.

    Of course there are, and it's worth pointing out when the combinations are unusual. But when dealing with symphonic works by symphonic composers, you're not imparting any inside information by announcing that pianos, brass and woodwinds are being used.

    It could be, but with classical music, this is almost always denoted in the album and/or track titles themselves (i.e. "for solo piano" or "wind concerto").

    And now that you know, you still know nothing of consequence about the sound of the music.

    You know, kind of like my references to "Det som engang var." Too bad you couldn't be bothered to actually read (much less comprehend) what I wrote before chiming in and cluttering the thread with Engrish.

    No, it says that Glass is a minimalist (which anyone could find out without reference to a single review of any sort, it's as useful as telling folks that Burzum played black metal, it's a fucking given).

    The actual quote is, "The usual stuff is here: arpeggio versus ostinato, ostinato versus arpeggio," which is like introducing a metal album by saying "there are distorted guitars," or referencing blastbeats in an Incantation review. Sure, they're there, but you're not telling anyone anything they didn't already know. It's a space filler and nothing else. The counterpoint reference likewise; what classical composer of the last 500 years HASN'T used counterpoint? You might as well note that Glass uses chords. This doesn't tell you anything that would distinguish the sound from any other composer of the last century, it's there to ensure that the review takes up the allotted column space. The truth is that what you've managed to do is dig up a mediocre review and re-define it as normative.


    ALLMUSIC is noted for some of the least accurate reviews in the world (seriously, read some of their metal reviews sometime, some of them appear to be based on albums they heard from the bleed through of a fellow commuter's headphones on the 7 train during morning rush), besides which, ALLMUSIC is a consumerist buyer's guide and nothing more. These aren't serious, intellectual reviews, they're blurbs meant to advertise shit for the people that fund them.
     
  2. Laeth MacLaurie

    Laeth MacLaurie New Metal Member

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    Nigga please! Are you the only person on the net that isn't aware of P2P?

    Besides, I'm not writing for Metallica and Pantera fans, they're not bright enough to get Burzum in the first place.
     
  3. Neurotic

    Neurotic New Millenium Christ

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    i agree allmusic sucks, but they are actually pretty good in the classical reviews, just type beethoven for instance, and you will have discriptions of each of his works.

    i think the usual stuff they mention is "usual glass music" which is full of those arpegiatted patterns.

    about the tecnical aspects, well , yes many classical works use those tecniques , like every other style of music, but at least gave you an idea of whats present in that work, not all classical pieces have countepoint(if it was a bach review then it would not be necessary) , not all pieces are filled with arpeggios (of course if its a symphony or a big piece most likely it will use them). and even chords, not all pieces have chords, it could be a solo lead instrument without chords like a violin partita( and theres many ways of using chords...)

    and usually when they mention aspects like that counterpoint or arpeggios in a review, is when they are very important in the piece, and stand out in the parts that are used. most music are filled with little arpeggios and most of the times you dont even notice, but if you hear a minor 7th chord arpeggiated for instance you know right there, its like listening to necrophagist and not mention that they abuse sweep arpeggios, its a definition of their sound.

    "the description of the music is as cursory as that in my own review". well if this review is mediocre. maybe your review is mediocre aswell hein?

    here is an example of a good classical review (from allmusic)

    Belá Bartok - Music For Strings, percussion and celesta

    Bartók wrote some of his finest music for the Swiss conductor Paul Sacher, in whom he found a particularly sympathetic champion. Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta, written for Sacher in 1936, explores with great refinement and mastery the musical concepts that Bartók had been developing since the mid-'20s. In the Piano Concerto No. 1, Bartók explored the percussive elements of the piano, coupling it effectively with percussion only in the introduction to the concerto's slow movement. In Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta, Bartók ingeniously sets the piano with the percussion instruments, where its melodic and harmonic material functions in support of the two string choirs.

    Since the early '30s, Bartók had also incorporated elements of Baroque music into his compositions, inspired partly by his exploration of pre-Classical keyboard composers such as Scarlatti, Rameau and Couperin. In reflection of this, Music for Strings, Percussion and Celesta evokes the Baroque concerto grosso, with its two antiphonal string orchestras separated by a battery of tuned and untuned percussion instruments. The work's prosaic title was actually just a working title which was subsequently allowed to stand.
    The opening movement, Andante tranquillo, is a slow fugue on a chromatic melody that springs from a five-note cell, each subsequent phrase growing in length and elaborating on its predecessor. At this point, the two string orchestras play together. As the string voices accumulate, the fugue's texture increases in complexity and the chromatic implications of the theme are brought to a rigorously dissonant fulfillment. The fugue climaxes at its apogee with an ominous rumble from the timpani and a loud stroke on the tam-tam. As the fugue folds in upon itself the celesta makes its first entrance with an arpeggiated chord, mysterious and remote. The work subsequently grows from the motivic material explored in this first movement.


    Bartók deploys antiphonal string choirs for the second movement, a fast, fugitive piece in which the two orchestras chase each other through a breathtaking series of elaborations on the main theme. In the percussion section, piano, xylophone, and harp take the lead while two side drums (with and without snares) provide emphatic punctuation. The third movement is one of Bartók's most accomplished "night music" pieces, with cricket-like notes from the xylophone, eerie timpani glissandi, fragmentary murmurs, and frightened exclamations from the strings, along with the always-mysterious notes of the celesta floating clear and sphinx-like over the nocturnal weft.


    The finale, a dance of energy and abandon, restores the antiphonal deployment of the strings and juxtaposes the diatonic aspects of the work's main theme with its chromatic elements. There are also some striking touches like the furious, strummed four-note chords in the violins, violas and cellos that opens the movement, a theme midway through that is based on a repeated note first hammered out on piano and xylophone, and then a grand peroration of the initial fugue theme, now with its intervals doubled and richly harmonized. In the quick coda there is a brief, suspended moment ("a tempo allargando") before the work tumbles to a conclusion in unabashed A major.


    i dont think a review(like i said before this is more like a discription but i like it ) like this is trying to "sell" the product.
     
  4. Laeth MacLaurie

    Laeth MacLaurie New Metal Member

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    I suppose it's a great review if you're a culturally deprived rube who isn't already familiar with a composer as foundational as Bartok, or if you're the kind of wanking anti-artist who obsesses about music theory, but as a review of a work of art, it fails miserably. Allmusic is for mental midgets who lack the intellect to appreciate actual analysis of music as art. Quote from real reviews, not from shills for record labels.
     
  5. Neurotic

    Neurotic New Millenium Christ

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    of course i know bartok, and like i said it is a discription, not a review, but when i'm looking for new composers that i don't know( you speak like bartok is very well known, to classical music lovers it is i guess), thats the kind of description i like, not a buch of adjectives, metaphors and subjective remarks. i know what i will hear. i couldn't care less about it makes the "reviewer" feel, cuz everybody can feel in a different way. Thats the beauty of art.

    And its one piece, i'm sure you are not familiar with every piece of music bartok has written, so it is helful for those who don't know the piece.

    how can you say this is a review to sell? it doesnt say its good or bad piece, just tells what happens in the music. your burzum review would help burzum sell much more records with all your praise for the album.

    and how would you review a piece like the bartok one? (if you know the piece...)
    what the concept of it? just tell me this...you can't because the concept is the music itself(exploring folk melodies, huge percussion) or if there is one, only the composer knows it.

    and i could give more reviews of the same piece if you want, but you will find them inferior and badly written because after all you are the most inteligent person in the world and your views are the norm.:loco:
     
  6. Son of Odin

    Son of Odin New Metal Member

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    Why the fuck does everyone have to go on and on about fucking bullshit trying to sound so clever and outwit each other? No one cares!!!
     
  7. TylerTheNuke

    TylerTheNuke I have eaten you

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    Of course they are. Everyone has to start somewhere. I used to be a fan of the backstreet boys :yuk:
     
  8. Cynical

    Cynical Member

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    Even though I agree with your point, this is a huge "no true scottsman" fallacy.
     
  9. byrne

    byrne Certavi et vici

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    Your obsession with replying to every post that doesn't agree with your pseudo-intellectual wankery of what is essentially an unfulfilling and boring album is amazing. I am also entertained by the fact that your insults are so subpar, for someone of your self-proclaimed (yet to be seen) intelligence. That being, the fact that they revolve around half-arsed assumptions about my musical preferences and the simple reference to two or three of my most recent posts at UM and extrapolating them as being what I have posted "over the years", like you would even know.

    Also liking music for "the window dressing" is not idiotic, if your purpose is to enjoy "good music". The fact that you are unable to appreciate music on any level, other than the "actual analysis of music as an art" is <IRONY>idiotic</IRONY>. So bad luck for being an utter thunder-cunt.
     
  10. anonymouscharacter

    anonymouscharacter New Metal Member

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    Guys, don't bother fuelling the fire with this idiot MacLaurie. It's evident that he gets off on writing some pseudo-intellectual horseshit then publicly attempting to humiliate those offering constructive criticism to reinforce his belief that he's a higher level being. Everyone on this board already knows that he lives at home with his parents, masturbates 5 times a day to internet sex stories and has a small dick - thus explaining his frustrations towards those with a better life than his own.
     
  11. MadeInNewJersey

    MadeInNewJersey nursing my wounds

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    I just stopped in to say this Laeth guy needs a swift boot to the teeth. Fucking pretentious twit.
     
  12. anonymousnick2001

    anonymousnick2001 World's Greatest Vocalist

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    The saddest part is that all our responses are "playing nto his hands," so to speak. In other words, we're giving him responses and criticism that he's predicted long before.

    The point is that his review was inadequate and unnecessarily pretentious in giving a highly opinionated and rather laughable individual interpretation of a work with simultaneous meanings to a multitude of people. The trick to reviews is point-significance, example-significance, etc. All he did was state the "significance," IN HIS OPINION, and then needlessly mire it in "duuuuude that's deeeeeep" statements in an attempt to be profound. Not only was a description of the album, in artistic sense even, anywhere to be found, but the endless awe of the reviewer could have easily been applied to the Black album by Metallica if he so chose.

    And the comments regarding jazz music were merely a passing atempt to be inflammatory, rooted in the depths of shit opinion, distant from anything resmbling even slightly respectable criticism, much less fact (as the tone of writing so denoted).

    Living proof that there really are two varieties of worthless posters.
     
  13. Neurotic

    Neurotic New Millenium Christ

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    exactly. he tries, but fails in the inteligence department:tickled:
     
  14. MadeInNewJersey

    MadeInNewJersey nursing my wounds

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    oh, he's intelligent. Just pompous as fuck, so it gets overshadowed.
     
  15. Neurotic

    Neurotic New Millenium Christ

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    sure, just not as inteligent as we wants to be eheh
     
  16. TylerTheNuke

    TylerTheNuke I have eaten you

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    Its okay. I mean, I liked the review, but the commencing arguments over the reviews are childish. I can sort of see both sides. I mean, I'd be pretty mad if everyone was pissing on my review like that, which I had worked hard on. But then again, Some of his arguments are way over the top. Jazz is a more sophisticated genre then metal, and improvising is an art. It involves more then muscle memory, although some people could try to improvise on autopilot, real musicians would see through it like that. I'm wondering if the reviewer is a musician at all. He ought to try improvising. It is pretty ambient, it might be intresting to try to pull a haunting solo on top of det som engang var. I can't because I play saxophone. See how it actually works. Understand the concept of soul, and why an improvisation is alive, unlike this, which isn't. Niggas make damn fine music :headbang:
     
  17. MadeInNewJersey

    MadeInNewJersey nursing my wounds

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    News flash: don't post a fucking review if you're going to be a sally about criticism of said review.
     
  18. Neurotic

    Neurotic New Millenium Christ

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    ok but at least admit the mistakes done, nothings perfect not even his review lol. most people gave valid arguments about the review so no reason to get mad.

    when i do a song for instance, if someone says reviews it with valid arguments i wont have an atittude like this guy even if they don´t like it.
     
  19. Demiurge

    Demiurge This user has no title

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    I don't think so.

    Now I have taken this from the wikipedia entry on the "no true scotsman" fallacy:
    Argument: "Ach! No Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge."
    Reply: "But my uncle Angus likes sugar with his porridge."
    Rebuttal: "Ah yes, but no true Scotsman puts sugar on his porridge."

    Let us call being a scotsman set (X) and putting sugar on porridge set (Z). A Scotsman is a man from Scotland. There is no correlation between being a native of a country and how one eats porridge. In other words, nothing precludes the sets from intersecting.

    Now, to the case at hand:

    Maclaurie: "No intellectual review of music as art includes in-depth discussion of music theory."
    Neurotic: allmusic.com review
    Maclaurie: "That is not an intellectual review of music as art."

    Regardless of what I personally think of the case at hand, in this case, there is no shift in definitions, as in the NTS fallacy. Maclaurie has already said what a "serious review of music as art" is. Neurotic could say "no, a serious review of music as art has the following characteristics..." to begin a discussion, but quoting a review is pointless.

    Back to the wikipedia article:
    If the first Scotsman explained that what he meant by the word "Scotsman" was, in fact, the text immediately above, there is no fallacy at all, just a simple misunderstanding. He is only committing the fallacy if he thinks putting sugar on porridge precludes one from being from Scotland.
     
  20. TylerTheNuke

    TylerTheNuke I have eaten you

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    Using a whole page (about) to rebutt one sentence that doesn't really affect the argument anyway :err:
     

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