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Doctor Who (new series) discussion

Discussion in 'LORD' started by Lord Tim, Sep 20, 2008.

  1. Nitephyre

    Nitephyre LORDwhore™/Andy's ManSWOS

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    I found it to be overly drawn out, boring Filler, unfortunately.
     
  2. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    Could not agree more! Also keen as punch for this week's episode. God I hope its not a massive letdown (at this point I'll even be satisfied with a minor letdown!)
     
  3. Shadow298

    Shadow298 UNLEASH THE GUAN

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    That finally episode was beyond awful.

    Typical Moffet in that he answers no questions, ends no lingering plot points & delivers nothing but shite.

    Major issues include:

    • Not knowing at first that the Lord President was actually Rasalon (sp?) because is a different actor & they never said his name. No resolution about the Final Sanction or whatever Davies called it. No mention of it or anything else from his last visit.
    • the waste of time with the hybrid. It was always meant to have been River Song but they fucked that up right royally. Making it both Dr & Clara was just stupid & lazy, it resolved nothing from any of her storylines. In fact the hybrid being brought in was utterly pointless.
    • Me being at the end of time was stupid. Don't know anyone who cared about the character but Moffat forced her down our throats one last time.
    • The Dr forgetting Clara & her getting her own TARDIS. Getting rid of companions is always difficult but this was the laziest & most obvious way ever. More so in the fact that she wants to go on adventures with Me (which undermines the Me character again) before the Time Lords put her back in her place in time.
    • the usual double narrative stuff of the Dr telling a story whilst the main story was going on. Defeats the purpose of having any tension.
    • trying to cement the Dr's past of being an orphan & what he did before he ran away from Gallifrey.
    All in all, could make so many more complaints but it all goes to a single point: be rid of Moffat.
     
  4. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    I tend to disagree a little with what you said, but I'll clarify.

    In isolation, I think there was a lot about this episode that was really good. Capaldi once again was great, a lot of the CGI was good, the other TARDIS looked surprisingly great on camera, there were some really nice moments in there in general.

    However...

    Yes, we've had the hybrid Doctor/Donna thing done before with almost exactly the same ending, and it was done FAR better the first time. So much misdirection as well with what the hybrid was supposed to be, the hinting about the Doctor being half human (a cheeky nod to the 1996 movie)... so many red herrings that it was more of a joke than a misdirection in the end.

    The Doctor is now mentally over 4 billion years old. Yes, it was just a week or so that he spent trapped in the Confession Dial but according to official sources, he pretty much remembered every time he went through the cycle. Think about that for a second. This is the same person who couldn't sit still for a week on Amy and Rory's couch.

    This is the guy who changed dramatically from the damaged war survivor in Series 1 to Wacky Doctor in Series 5 - literally 5 years in show. And then it gets stupid. The Doctor runs for 200 years in The Impossible Astronaut and comes back like nothing happens, and then sits at Trenzalore for 300 years defending it (not looking for any other option like the Doctor does every other adventure, mind you) and then regenerates and is more or less the same person, and then runs for another couple of hundred years at the start of this season, and then mentally ages BILLIONS of years before wandering out. And how has the character grown? ZERO. It's nothing more than a clever big number and has no bearing on the character at all. Lazy as fuck writing.

    Even worse is Ashildir who actually *is* billions of years older. And for someone who apparently had a hard time remembering who she was just hundreds of years earlier, which is why she called herself "Me", now here she is billions of years later at the end of the universe and all we see that's changed is she has longer hair and a nose stud. Yep. How's the consistency working out for everyone?

    Arc wise it was again a complete mess. OK, I loved that they're back on Gallifrey. I love the other TARDIS. There was a lot of good. But hey, let's look at this again. At the end of 11's cycle, he discovers Gallifrey is trapped in a pocket universe at the end of time and everyone survived, and he needs to go find it. Fuck yeah, great motivation for the next couple of years. So what happened? Missy mentioned it one time in one episode, and then suddenly 2 years later, without any other hints or inclination he's actually looking for it, here we are. All of the drama and suspense that could have been built up is entirely gone. What should have been a massive moment when the Doctor wandered out and saw the Citidel was like "Oh that's cool." rather than "FUCK!!"

    So Missy was the one that arranged the Doctor and Clara to be the hybrid? What part of the story was this hinted in over the last few years? Uh, none. AT ALL. It was a throw away line near the end of the finale. This is a major plot point and it was reduced to a line?

    Speaking of throw away lines, how hard would it to have been to go "You are a much more driven man since your regeneration, Rassilon." from one of the other council members. Why leave that ambiguous if you didn't need to? Yes, people would have worked it out, but for something which is as easy as a one line addition to make the story and characters crystal clear, it's yet another huge oversight.

    And yes, once again, everyone lives. And it seems they now live forever! And they have their own TARDIS. And with what the Doctor remembers, and and the precedent that was set in Series 5 and 6 about "anything that can be remembered can be brought back", that's left the door wide open for both Clara and Ashildir to wander in at any time. But not quite just yet, we have the Christmas episode with River in it... who, you know, was dead. Several times now.

    Sigh.

    There is SO MUCH potential for this Doctor. So much potential for great story lines, especially now. The production values are great, there's enough stuff that's been reset to freshen up the show. But it's being turned into a joke despite itself. When one of the strongest episodes in the entire season can get a huge post like this about all the things that I feel is wrong with it, that's a problem. And that problem needs to be replaced with a new show runner before it's too late, IMO.
     
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  5. Nitephyre

    Nitephyre LORDwhore™/Andy's ManSWOS

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    Mmm, it was OK... until Clara wasn't dead. Truth be told, I still miss Christopher & Billie. Oh well.
     
  6. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    Yeah look, I don't disagree that from a continuity standpoint there was a lot that was lacking in the finale.

    BUT, overall it was good. There was nothing overly cringe-worthy about it like there has been moments of in almost every episode the last couple of seasons.
     
  7. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    I should know by now to avoid the Christmas specials. Sigh. A couple of nice parts and a couple of funny gags but the rest was dire.

    Doctor Who has really turned into Queensryche for me. A band I loved, that always moved me and I'd been following since I was a kid that slowly turned into shit, and each album that comes along you just keep hoping and wanting it to be good but invariably you'd be disappointed, and you'd try so damn hard to look for the good parts in amongst the steaming shit pile. If it was any other band I would have walked away and stopped putting myself through the torture but since it had such a special place in my heart, I persisted.

    Queensryche fired the one guy that was entirely fucking things up and from the 2013 self titled album onwards, it was like a whole new band again, back with the right vibe, a freshness and that feeling that was missing for so long. There were happy tears.

    Doctor who needs to fire that one asshole too. But we live in hope, hey?
     
  8. Shadow298

    Shadow298 UNLEASH THE GUAN

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    Xmas special was beyond fucking shite.

    A waste to watch. Added nothing, did nothing but piss me off.
     
  9. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    Finally watched it so its safe for me to visit this thread :p

    Fucking LOVE the Queensryche analogy LT. Oh so true. About Dr Who, and 'ryche.

    Oh Dr Who, where is my Condition Human?
     
  10. Shadow298

    Shadow298 UNLEASH THE GUAN

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    It's not Dr Who but still Moffat/Gatiss related:

    Sherlock the Abominable Bride was fucking terrible.

    Stan (streaming service) aired it right after it premiered on the BBC so didn't have to waste money to see it in the cinema.

    was nothing but bad fan service, dodgy plotting & cheap gags.
    So like recent Dr Who efforts.
     
  11. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    That's such a shame as Sherlock mostly has been brilliant. Thankful I didn't bother seeing it at the cinema! But will still check it out via other means....
     
  12. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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  13. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    I'm cautiously optimistic about Chris Chibnal. His Doctor Who episodes were average to poor and his Torchwood ones were awful but Broadchurch was sensational. Guess we'll find out at the end of 2017...!
     
  14. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    Hopefully him not having to work under Moffat and around any thematic constraints etc due to that will mean things will be better.

    Fingers crossed!
     
  15. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    So Christmas episode - what did we think?

    No spoilers in case people haven't watched it yet, but bottom line is I enjoyed it. Nothing earth shattering, lots of issues with it, but a "nice" episode.
     
  16. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    Yeah, I agree - that was entirely inoffensive, especially compared to the steaming shit we've been given over the last few years. I can see why people were upset about it not feeling like Doctor Who because of where it was based but why should the show only happen in the UK when you have all of space and time, which would possibly include New York?

    But yeah, in my exhausted state last night, I found it a generally fun watch. :)
     
  17. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    DOCTOR WHO IS BACK!!

    Got to say I quite enjoyed the latest episode :)
     
  18. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    I thought it was quite decent, although it did smack a bit of Moffat trying his hardest to channel RTD with the family thing. I reckon that *mostly* worked, and the baddie was suitably menacing. Some odd choices for music in this episode though, although the call back to Clara's theme and a few others were nice. Also nice to see River and Susan in the pics on the Doctor's desk.

    Hopefully this doesn't turn into a convoluted mess though. Already it's just being assumed that the Doctor was at the university for more than 50 years, which makes it overlap with a HEAP of his own personal timeline in the same area, and the "we are guarding this vault" thing is was sort of a "but why?" McGuffin moment.

    I'd give it an 8/10.
     
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  19. Lord Tim

    Lord Tim That guy from LORD

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    Smile: done by the same writer as In the Forest of the Night, which I thought was absolutely dogshit. This was much better, if derivative (The Ark in Space meets The Happiness Patrol, anyone?) and a bit pedestrian, and an ending someone forgot to write so they put in a literal reset button. Lazy.

    I'd give it a 5/10. Still better than the barely 1/10 I gave his last effort however.
     
  20. cowboy

    cowboy Member

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    Hahaha yeah well said. Thought it was very derivative and hokey, but it didn't truly suck as some of the episodes from the last couple of seasons have!
     

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