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Discussion in 'General Metal Discussion' started by The Ozzman, Jan 7, 2015.
Do you know about the 'Replace' feature in notepad? Just do Replace ")" with "". Click replace all.
Triple post, I know. But HB I just wanted to make clear my point. It's not an 'originality' contest. It's a 'who did it best' contest. At least from my point of view. People get too hung up on 'who did it first'. Objectively, I like Black Future better.
There probably should have been 2 threads. Old School Thrash Metal, and another thread for New Wave of Thrash Metal.
I partially agree, many good bands formed in last ?10? years, but do you think there is enough material out to make top 20? Also, would we include old bands that got together again or just new bands.
The sound of thrash hasn't really changed that much, I don't think we can label some band as new thrash just by sound, majority of new bands are trying to sound like old, just with modern production, thus I think such list would be pointless.
Maybe we could do some general "New Metal" list including all the genres, cut off only by year. In such case, the x-albums per band would not be needed, since everyone has his favourite genre and because really, is there any band that is consistenly better than everyone else in past 10 years or such?
There's way more diversity in the list I posted than that. If making a phylogenetic tree, Destruction would be one of the main branches with their tight/choppy style of riffing and high level of aggression, with Aspid, Believer, Coroner, and Vektor branching off at varying points. Voivod would be the other major branch of significance to Vektor, doing the spacy dissonant hardcore thing, DBC retaining more of the punk, Obliveon and Vektor more of the spaciness (not really any hardcore in those two at all). The most novel aspect to Vektor (which is also the most minor) is probably the black metal influence, like those Emperor-style tremolo melodies you can find in songs like DNA and Forests of Legend. The way it comes together is enough to say that they have their own sound, sure, but a lot of people seem to think that they came out of a vacuum and are the most amazing life-changing thing to happen to thrash since the mid 80s.
Definitely agree that 1990-1993 were about as strong as the 80s if you dig for gems. Wouldn't put anything I've heard from those newer acts up there though. If Deceptor puts out a full-length instead of another EP I could see them cracking the top 40-50 potentially. Immaculate too if their new album continues the trajectory from Atheist Crusade.
I'm not even trying to make it purely a matter of originality/who did it first. Between Vektor's two albums, I'd say there are at least several songs that are pretty standard thrash metal with just their trademark sound (vocals, spaciness, etc) put on top. A 40~50 minute Vektor best-of would probably make it to my top 30, but there's too much redundancy/filler on those albums.
I don't know why I didn't think if the find and replace feature. I used that for something else in the same damn spreadsheet today. Oh well.
Also: having two threads for thrash is splitting hairs. Once I'm done with the base genres it is fair game if people want to get more and more specific with these polls
Black Future contains zero black metal ... absolutely none. Your ears must be fuckin' broken. Also regardless of what you seem to think, tremolo picking doesn't automatically make everything black metal bro.
Forests of Legend is one of my favorite tracks, please point out the "black metal" parts ... please.
I can't remember if it was HBB or Effigy that was trying to say Vektor were a black metal or blackened thrash band a few years back, even sig'd them for it.
I wouldn't even call it "blackened" thrash, and like I said it's the most minor element of the album, but some of those melodies sound more In the Nightside Eclipse-style than anything you could find in thrash prior. You sigged me for calling Protest the Hero's Scurrilous a superior tech-thrash album to Black Future (which I still stand by).
I might be confusing Forests for another song; I keep notes for little things like that sometimes and I didn't point it out in that one, and doing a quick skim on YouTube I don't hear it. The melody in the intro of DNA is one example; especially around 2:35 where they revisit it but add blasting. In fact, even some of the chords immediately before that at 2:15, combined with that slower rhythm, sound a lot like something that could fit in a black metal song. I'm pretty sure there's at least one other song they have with hints of that as well, maybe one of their other 10 minute songs, but whatevs. I'm fine saying that it's about 2% black metal, but I still hear it as an influence. IIRC in an interview (or maybe an old MySpace page) one of them even mentioned Emperor as an influence.
Yeah that was an excellent era for thrash. You've probably heard me say it before but I prefer early 90's thrash to 80's thrash as current listening material. At that point I feel like thrash had reach its most developed form, and it was as technical as thrash ever has been.
There we disagree and it's just a matter of opinion. But then maybe you haven't given the newer acts enough of a chance? Maybe you are just basing your opinions on 'they sound like these older bands'? Maybe they do it better.
don't feel like going there bro. I'm just going to let myself enjoy Vektor as much as I do.
Probably a nitpick but those Vektor albums are just too long for me.
Didn't hear anything special about Time is Up; it's slightly interesting in that it shows how retro-thrash is evolving from 1985 to 1988 but it still sounds like stuff that plenty of Bay Area bands did better. I've heard a bit of the second Hexen album since a lot of people were talking it up, and thought it sounded pretty decent at the time, but haven't followed up on that. Newest Exmortus sounds decent, but like I said in another thread, I don't consider it a thrash album on the whole. Haven't listened to any Fueled By Fire since that first album with the TRUE FRASHER strangling the POSERS, assumed they were still crap.
Yep. Oddly enough it's not the longest songs that suffer but the medium ones; their epics typically have enough happening to justify it, but it's the six~seven minute songs that could stand to lose a couple minutes.
First Fueled by Fire album was indeed crap ... but their last two, especially Plunging Into Darkness are some killer slabs of thrash metal. If we made a list for top thrash albums of the last 10 years, PID would make that list.
Havok on the other hand suck. Time is Up is pretty cool, nothing special ... but their other two albums are total crapfests.
Havok's strongest release is the EP.
Pwn Em All!!!!11
Best riff on it (and probably from their career) is a Ulysses Siren ripoff. Something about that really bothers me. Like, if you steal an obvious Slayer riff everyone is going to know it, but you start going after demo bands and that shit's kinda shady.
Time Is Up is what I'd call arena thrash. It's catchy as fuck, with amazing drumming. It's the AC/DC of thrash, and that's not a bad thing in their case.
Fueled by Fire has matured a lot. Their latest Trapped in Perdition is excellent and full of evil sounding sick riffs, almost like a more technical version of Slayer.
Hexen - Being and Nothingness was an entire experience for me. An album where not just the music (high quality prog thrash) but especially the lyrics spoke to me deeply. I was going through some shit at that time and had a lot of the same feelings about the meaning of life. I probably rate it higher because of that, but still listen at least to the last song on that album. I consider it their masterpiece. A lot of neoclassical stuff going on like Exmortus. I use this album cover as my avatar some places I liked it so much..
"It all ends in perplexity", the final lyric. Just like their career man. I think the band might have left us for good. Such a shame. Some of the best neoclassical thrash ever written.
The two Hexen albums are fucking top notch. Without a doubt some of the best thrash metal of the last 25 years. Along with Vektor, they stand head and shoulders above the rest of the "modern/new wave" thrash bands. It really broke my heart that they called it quits.
edit: All four of their albums(Hexen + Vektor) are future classics.
This album is as good as any early Kreator album
Deathraiser - Violent Aggression
Or the band that made me almost believe that Mille had a side project... These guys deserves more recognition!
Yea that album is killer .... but c'mon now, i wouldn't say it's better then early Kreator, and it definitely doesn't even hold a candle to PtK.
AoB are okay.
Unnatural Selection got me interested in thrash again. That's all I'm gonna say about Havok.