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Discussion in 'In Flames' started by Ilias7, Feb 7, 2020.
Brutal comments about poor Fredrik
It's interesting how there's a difference in perception depending on the person. I mean, compare what he says with what Bjorn says about working with Nordstrom and why they stopped the relationship.
And compare it with what Nordstrom said suggesting that the break was mainly Anders fault.
One thing we know for sure is that Anders, Bjorn and Jesper are lazy - so it doesn't surprise me that they all had some problem working with Fredrik, who tries to get the best out of the people he works with rather than letting them release sub-par material. Even after all these years it seems like IF never really learned the value of having a proper work ethic. The only time they really put effort into an album after Nordstrom was SOAPF which turned out pretty great. Then they shit the bed with SC and Battles and lost a lot of fans in the process.
Looks like even Jesper has mixed feelings about the Nordstrom effect.
And yes, they did work hard back then
I’m going to sound like a Dad here but the In Flames story is a great life case study.
Work hard, be disciplined, focus your energy, and pay attention to every detail and your outputs are going to be respected and revered.
No matter how talented you are, if you don’t do those things your output will very likely be mediocre to poor. Only way around it is having a rigid structure / process imposed on you. Either by yourself, a boss, or a producer.
Alright kids, don’t be like In Flames. Listen and learn.
That's mostly my opinion and comments about Bjorn's last interview. If he thinks that making music, or any other creative work, is about feeling inspired and not doing hard work then he has a big problem. That might be the reason as to why his guitar playing has not improved with time but the opposite.
What is interesting is that when they worked with Nordstrom they thought they were “poor”. Meanwhile every kid with a band in America dreamed of working with him someday.
After they got some money they thought they could buy their way out of working. They are still doing that today. Typically the “better” the producer, the less they do.
Anders & Bjorn have a very warped perception of their music, completely at odds with pretty much everyone else who listens to their discography objectively.
I did laugh when I saw some clip of Anders (in relation to the rerecordings) saying "of course we are better musicians now, we are better at our craft than we were back then" and practically all the comments being like "LOL no"
To be fair at least Anders has taken some lessons. And he has good growling techniques That’s why I don’t give him too much shit on his voice. At least he’s doing something. But I listened to IF for the music (guitars). Haven’t seen any progress on that. Just steadily sliding backwards.
I wouldn't say Anders sounds massively better now than he did between 1996-2006 to be honest. Technically he has a better growling technique but he rarely uses it on record and fluctuates live between being great and being poor. As far as his singing has concerned if anything he's somehow gotten worse and less confident over time. He sounded better singing on Reroute to Remain than he does on any of these rerecordings which is just sad.
Guitar-wise it's difficult to judge as Jesper was such a huge part of the sound until he left. I can't seriously compare anything post-2008 with anything that came before it, even SOAPF. To me that is a new band and a new In Flames.
I still argue no one can tell the difference between Bjorn and Jesper’s contributions starting with RtR or maybe even before. Can anyone point to something in RTR, STYE, CC, ASOP that is definitely Jesper?
It's not necessarily a thing, it's more the overall composition and feel of the pre-SOAPF records. Jesper has an incredible ear for melody which Bjorn doesn't possess, and that comes through at various points during Jesper's time in the band. I can listen to older IF stuff, even some of the songs on ASOP, nowadays and still hear something I never caught before every so often. That's Jesper's touch.
SOAPF, SC, Battles & ITM all have moments where the melodies are good, and in SOAPF's case even great sometimes, but I rarely hear anything new musically on any of these albums that I didn't hear the first time That depth that came from the Bjorn/Jesper collaboration isn't there anymore - and that isn't Bjorn's fault, that's just a consequence of having one less mind contributing to the songwriting process.
Also the recycling of riffs began in earnest once Jesper left - Bjorn is quite reliant on this, even on SOAPF. Also the flat-out lifting of riffs/melodies from older material only started when Jesper left - example, Black and White riff at the start of Everything's Gone, or the Square Nothing rip off in I Am Above (there is also an I'm the Highway riff rip off on ITM, but I can't remember which song now).
@3:30 Love this Behind Space breakdown. So \m/
I have said it many times but Lunar Strain is a massively underappreciated record. With better production and a few tweaks most of those songs would be just as good as anything from the golden period. You can already hear in Behind Space '99 and Clad in Shadows '99 how improved production and small musical tweaks turns promising demo tracks into amazing songs.
It would have been amazing to hear Starforsaken, In Flames, Everlost Part 2 and Upon an Oaken Throne rerecorded around the Colony period. Sadly we will have to make do with BS and CiS - thank god modern day Anders/Bjorn seem to have no inclination to butcher anything pre-Clayman.
The recycling thing I can see. Although even on ASOP they were reaching back.
I guess from RTR to CC at least you can say there wasn’t much rip off material from old albums.
After reading that Whoracle article where Jesper talked about flow, I guess he would never have allowed Rusted Nail to come out.
I think Jesper would have taken major issue with a lot of Siren Charms. If there's one thing he knows how to do it is to construct music so that it flows effortlessly. No IF album with Jesper involved, even Lunar Strain, has issues with disjointed instruments or amateur arrangements. That is very much a post-Jesper issue which mainly comes down to Anders & Bjorn not having Jesper's ear for music and not caring enough to put proper effort into making these things work.
Now granted the producer and/or mixing engineer should bring this shit to their attention, but evidently they don't like being told what to do or being asked to work harder than absolutely necessary, so I'm guessing that attitude spreads to the rest of the team they are working with.
With that said Howard Benson's In Flames don't have problems when it comes to song structures, but it's mainly because those structures are painfully simple and Benson is the one guy Anders & Bjorn probably would listen to because for whatever reason they are infatuated with the guy and basically worship him as their saviour.
According to the DT Instagram, their producer was working on the final song 11 days ago. Crossing my fingers for some good stuff.
A stone cold classic MDM DT song from the glory days.
Also I regret shitting on the OFTW rerecording in the YT comments section as my phone notifies me every time someone 'likes' my comment, which is so far 134 times, and I have no idea how to stop it.