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My snare completely changed because of limiter!

Discussion in 'Production' started by Nico_pitty, Oct 5, 2011.

  1. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    Hi guys.. in this weeks i'm trying to get a perfect snare tone for me...aeverything goes well till i active the limiter in the master chain...it seems that when i active it the snare get more tail evein if i put an envelope shaper in its channel...moreover i have to cut high frequency but when i do that it sounds to low...i tried also to set it from the eq or from the multiband comp of master but this made change all the body of the track!! :confused:
     
  2. gotet10

    gotet10 Learner

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    Try remixing with every thing at a lower level then add your processing to the master bus.
     
  3. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    I'll try it! ;)
     
  4. DevonSteelman

    DevonSteelman Producer/Engineer

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    Putting a transient designer on a drum isn't going to stop it from getting smashed by your limiter. Nor will turning everything down. You might as well just change the threshold on your limiter for less gain reduction. It's essentially the same thing. The answer is simple though; start clipping all your drums. Use GClip or the T-RackS clipper, they're great for this.
     
  5. Vinny

    Vinny Member

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    Oh the amount of things wrong with this sentence...
     
  6. DevonSteelman

    DevonSteelman Producer/Engineer

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    I completely understand there's way more factors into why the OP's drums are probably getting smashed.. But guess what? I'm not psychic, and I tried to understand and help with what he gave me. If you think I'm wrong, that's great. I'd love to learn and/or hear what you have to say. But to sarcastically say I'm wrong and not have any explanation at all as to why.. Well, that's just you being a dick and acting superior for the sake of it. I'm definitely not the only one here either who clips their drums to avoid them from getting smashed to hell and back by master limiters.
     
  7. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    Hi Devon...i tried gclip as you tell me....now my snare is:
    envelope shaper compressor limiter g clip...but i have the same problem..in other words i have to cut all the frequency cos it seems that each of these has more punch when i active the master ozone...so I find that the snare has more high frequencies very boring to my ears...when i high pass the high i have to low pass the snare in order to have less low..but after this process i think that my snare couln't sound as a snare of attack attack!!
     
  8. Folkrav

    Folkrav Jean-Sébastien Beaulieu

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    Wait wait wait... did you just said that you are low-passing to remove lows? o_O Think of it a second... low-pass... the LOWs will PASS through...

    It seems like you are just overdoing things a bit. Can you explain why you put the envelope shaper, the comp, the limiter and the gclip, or you just did it because you heard it was good? Each plugin you add must have it's use, not be thrown there randomly. Probably that each plugin over there is contributing to the problem... Compressor will bring up unwanted frequencies, the master limiter will attenuate the transients (so it will INDEED as a side-effect "bring up" the tails)... Think of the reason behind each of your plugins. They must do something useful - thrown everywhere, they can do the opposite and bring new problems.
     
  9. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    Sorry Folkrav i explained very bad my problem...i do an high pass and a low pass...i'll try to take out compressor ...i think snare 11a it's already compressed...
     
  10. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    I think that is the multiband compressor in ozone...it ruins all my works...but at this point i don't know how cut or pass some frequencies!!!
     
  11. Fandus

    Fandus Member

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    If the multiband is ruin your mixes don't use it. Ideally it should be hardly even compressing, most people tend to use it to tame the low end a little and that's about it.
     
  12. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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  13. Folkrav

    Folkrav Jean-Sébastien Beaulieu

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    But the question is...

    - Why do you use the low-pass/hi-pass?
    - Why do you use limiter/gclip on snare?
    - Why would you want to EQ and/or multiband your master?
    - Why? why? why?

    As I told you, I feel you just do things because you've been told that's what other people do, thus overdoing everything... And indeed, Slate samples hardly need any dynamic treatment (comp, limiting, etc.)...
     
  14. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    You're right Folk...i do all this things cos i heard people doing like that!
    I want to eq and/or multiband my master because i find my guitar tone really incomplete without a master treatment...i mean the guitar without an external eq sounds too bad...
    and moreover i'm not able to make all my track sound homogeneus and i hope that, using eq or mutliband, i'll do that...
    advice?? =) thnx man!!
     
  15. timislegend

    timislegend Member

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    save youself all the time in the world and just focus on more headroom.


    it is key to having more control of your mixes.


    secondly... it never hurts to hpf everything. get rid of all the crud you aren't using then put the crud back in with frequency enhancers.


    simple! :)
     
  16. Folkrav

    Folkrav Jean-Sébastien Beaulieu

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    Honestly, before even thinking of mastering, make a good mix. As I've been said countless times, garbage-in/garbage-out - you can't give a good master without a good mix first. Mastering isn't the magical solution that will solve all problems you will encounter in your mixing process. Start by fixing the mix.

    I find out that all my guitar tones are pretty "thin", half of guitar tones comes from proper bass processing that will support it. I don't know how you work, but I suggest starting from scratch and work out each single instrument one at a time. Don't try to integrate something else in your mix before the thing you're mixing in sounds good. And only go back on what you've done for "carving in" a place in frequency range if you find out that the thing you just added is fighting with a previous addition.

    For an example, I start with drums, then try to integrate guitars. I then add bass. Oops, bass frequencies are jumping all over the place? Probably fighting with bassdrum and/or guitars - go back and filter out/tame those bass frequencies that fight with the bass. Problem solved? Integrate next item.

    This way of working should help keeping your mix clean, I guess.
     
  17. Nico_pitty

    Nico_pitty Nick

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    Thanks Tim Thanks Folk...
    To folk:you're perfectly right...
    Now..after you have told me this,i realise that my way of working is too much confusional...i'll try to work more on the mix and less on the master...after i'll work with the master...
    Sorry for the stupid answers i usually make,but i'm learning steo by step how to produce a good work,and i need someone who can led me to the right way...
    Anyway,according to you,i'm a user of cubase.For the guitar tone,you think that i have eq jusy with pod farm or also eq with eq of the channel?
    Seth told me that i have to simplify but i don't know if it's better eq also the channel in order to cut the useless frequencies of my guitar or not!
     
  18. Folkrav

    Folkrav Jean-Sébastien Beaulieu

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    I usually setup the ampsim to sound the best / achieve the sound I'm looking for in completion with the bass, then with EQ on the guitar buss, I cut the useless frequencies (this usually means hi-pass + low pass at various values depending on the tone I wanna achieve + musical style + various reasons) plus a cut in the annoying frequencies (usually means around 4kHz for ampsims, where they usually sound razor-like - most ampsims really fails to render this frequency range with good results).

    I don't like to boost frequencies on guitar buss. If the tone isn't what you want, cut to remove the useless instead of boosting.

    Also keep in mind that, as a general rule, removing is better than adding.
     
  19. beechstudio

    beechstudio Member

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    Try removing the limiter on the snare channel and use parallel compression. It's saved me numerous times! That way you can mix the processed and unprocessed snares together to your liking. It sounds more natural to my ears anyway. YMMV....
     

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