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Discussion in 'Bar' started by Drummerrrrr?, Dec 3, 2014.
Care to fill in on this one?
Sometimes I feel the album sounds great and sometimes just average. The snare sounds good but at times it's like there are 2 attacks separated by miliseconds. Like when a sample is not perfectly aligned with the natural drum sound.
Also hate the clean vocals. I know it's a matter of taste but it sounds out of context with the density and aggressiveness of the rest of the music.
He means they have the multitracks loaded on a computer and then some parts, or all parts, could be actually coming from the multitracks instead of the live microphones. Some bands use the kicks like this. It might be true with In Flames, I don't know. I just remember the guy randomly hitting the drums and it sounded the same, so I think the drums are actually miked and they might be using kicks from a recorded source, I didn't see any triggers either way but who knows with trigger/drumagog in live version anyway now !
Haha I did get WHAT they are doing and how
I'm more interested in why the hell would someone do this!
EDIT: The drummer might also be using the kind of triggers that mount under the top skin (easy to hide with white/black finish skins). Don't know though, haven't watched any In Flames lives to see if Daniel uses clear/coated.
I'm not against using triggers live at all, but having something like the kick coming from the backing track is really against the whole live playing. Then again, I only dig having intros/outros and ambient/etc segments during breaks between songs played from a backing track.
Took a listen in the studio. I think it's way to thick in the 400hz area. And that leads to it being very dense so i think it will be quite fatiguing in the long run.
But it sounds awesome either way!
I actually think this album may take over TWOAF for my references.
Ok this album is really, really growing on me. I don't think it's that bad in terms of length. So far didn't get caught in the middle of Alpha, but Omega got me by surprise.
By the way 4:30 and onwards is one of the most aggressive things I have heard recently.
Omega the song is absolute prog epicness. And the outro is pure heaviness too. I wish they did this kind of breaks more. It has balls, and vibe.
The more I listen to spencer, the more I like him. I don't like the teenage vocal effects he does, but damn, what a perfect pitch and clear voice tone. The dude is absolutely impressive.
To interject quickly while the discussion is still going, many of the production aspects people are noting weren't accidental. There was a strong directive from the band for the record to be quite low and low-mid dominant. Both Adam and I iterated quite a bit until it felt right. The intent was never for the record to be bright and snappy, but more what I'd personally call 'monumental' sounding. Striking and distinctive, from the moment you hear it.
Yeah it sounds awesome either way man! And I get that it was all intentional. It is still very balanced and clear. Just the personal preference blabla you know
I think it was their last EP, where I thought the drums sounded really programmed despite being recorded.
I get why people wouldn't (want to) believe that something like this could be archived with natural drums. There's this video of Larsen/Halpern that sounds unreal good as well.
All you need, is "just":
-an unreal good consistent hitting monster drummer (both in velocity and where to hit the drums)
-huge huge attention to detail with the tuning of the drums to notice if anything goes off or if any mics/drums move (not bad if you do that all the time with everthing)
-some great bleed management, especially for the snare track, and knowing how to mix/record it to make it bright and snappy enough without elevating all the bleed...this is where the great drummer helps an awful lot, altho I'd really like to know how to make the snare snap like that without making any of the cymbal bleed come up in the snare. Or where the shells tracked separately?
I think this could be the first periphery album I can enjoy! Liking the production more than the songs. The first time I really like an Axe FX tone as well!
Great work all around!
Some of those tracks did have programmed drums. Shells weren't tracked separately on the latest album.
blend snare top track with a heavily gated/heavily compressed parallel snare top track.
Yeah sure, but I think that most of the time that still brings up the "shht" of the HH and especially the china in the attack. Even gated really short it sounds pretty unnatural to me in a lot of cases.
That works if you managed to keep the bleed really low, and make the snare sound pretty bright and snappy to begin with. Never heared it to that extend yet I think though.
Never underestimate the power of transient designers, specially on parallel processing. You don't get rid of all the cymbal bleed, but you can get to a point it doesn't stand in your way. That way you make a "snap" track.
Also, all those things you said before...
yes it can be a really nice tool (decapitator any one? ), but again, the overheads aren't really loud overall in the mix (compared to the snare), so I'm really wondering how not to make the chinas audible in the snare at all, even with parallel processing.
Also never underestimate how much bleed drops when you've got a good drummer beating the shit out of the snare relative to the cymbals. The best way to lower your noisefloor is to increase the direct signal; in this case, the sound of the drum itself. How do you make drums louder IRL? Hit them harder (for the most part).
Gotta play a huge part as well!
Don't get me wrong guys, I'm not saying I don't believe that it's all natural or anything. Just genuinely interested.
Totally, I know what you mean. I wouldn't be surprised if there was some sample-enforcement on the hard hits of the snare, but listening to the studio doc/album, the two sound really similar, and you can quite audibly hear china/cymbal bleed in the toms as they come in for certain parts - Toms are 100% natural in any case.
Blend or not I think it's all good in the grand scheme of things. Of course you won't sound like this at 2:10 easily with natural drums, but I haven't been shocked by periphery's drums on this album. All in all, I'm still more annoyed by the djenty guitar gating even if they have gone a way more natural way this time, and I'm surprised people discuss drums editing or sample replacement when guitars are tighter than humanly playable. These guys are of course as tight as a virgin catholic schoolgirl from japan, but still !
And btw I'm not even complaining about anything guitar wise on this album. There is some pretty, pretty smooth solo and song writing going on in there, and that is an absolute refreshment to my ears ! I haven't liked a real "metal" album so much recently.
I'm finding this album better and better each time I listen to it, and that's something for me considering how the trend they pretty much lead in annoys me !
I only said it because I know nolly does it.