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New Underworld Track: Without You

Discussion in 'Symphony X (Unofficial)' started by PrgrsveMetalnChains, Jun 21, 2015.

  1. PrgrsveMetalnChains

    PrgrsveMetalnChains Vocal Prince

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    To begin, my wife hates Symphony X. She listens to pop hits and says I have overplayed Symphony X to the point where she knows when it's them being played and says it sounds like "magic show music". Hah.

    Regardless, I learned to listen to my favorite band with headphones and on my own time...just another sacrifice! :)

    I played the new track "Without You" today way loud with our home entertainment system thinking nothing of it and she runs to me going, "who the hell is that? It's amazing!" I just wanted to cry of happiness.

    Man, what an incredible song they created with this one. Nevermore was good, but god this Without You is written so well. It really shows what Romeo has been saying to be true, that they really focused on the song itself this album. Really looking forward to the rest if this was their choice for a single.
     
  2. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    It's a solid little ballad. Nothing special, and I feel like any modern metal band could have made it. There are only a couple parts in the solo sections where it's even clear that it's Romeo playing.

    Also, Michael Pinnella appears to have been fired, so there's that...
     
  3. EyeballKid

    EyeballKid Shyamalan'd

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    Thank you for this. The fact that this song could have such an impact proves that new Symphony X music is still a magical thing, despite the constant negativity by all 10 people on an internet message board.
     
  4. warpig25

    warpig25 Member

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    without you touches soul, thats all that matters
     
  5. PrgrsveMetalnChains

    PrgrsveMetalnChains Vocal Prince

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    Yeah man. It's pretty amazing that a band that has been known to sort of change their style for the worst with the last two albums according to fans, have turned around and put something like this out.

    My thing is, who gives a flying **** if the song seems "radio friendly". This is the band doing what they love and doing it EXTREMELY well. Nothing crazy technical or full of keyboard/symphony suites...just a great solid track man.

    So many of the same people are always so quick to bash a band because they may not be doing what they did four albums ago, but that's progression. I would LOVE to see a band like this make it in the mainstream. Selling out? Absolutely not. Just making good music. Period. Which is still leaps and bounds better than 99.9% of the crap rock/metal on the radio these days.

    Also I totally disagree with Postulate on saying "It's a solid little ballad. Nothing special, and I feel like any modern metal band could have made it." Name another modern metal band that could write and perform a song this good with the same quality vocal melodies and musicianship and get back to me. All standard modern metal acts put out these days are extremely mediocre and cliche songs with half ass vocal performances. Nothing even close to this caliber, even if it does seem like a solid ballad. They aced it.

    The fact that someone such as my wife heard it for the first time and loved it not knowing anything about this type of music or band is great and proves that they do still have that "magical" quality in their music. Maybe not every song or album, but it's still there. This track proves that.
     
  6. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    Name one that couldn't, I guess? This track would fit comfortably on just about any modern power metal album as the obligatory track 6 ballad or whatever. The only sign that it's SX is the acoustic guitar motif which sounds vaguely like Divine Wings and the fact Russell Allen is singing, of course.

    What do you think is good about it, out of curiosity? It just seems really bland and generic to me. It's just some forced/flat melodies w/power chords in an extremely predictable/generic structure. It doesn't even have a real rhythm guitar backing it, and no one besides Russ and Romeo are even doing anything.

    I'm going to politely suggest that your love of this band has blinded you to the quality of this song.

    With all due respect, that's exactly what this track is. Mediocre & cliche. We should be honest even with the bands we love.
     
  7. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    Also, since I see this defense trotted out so much, no, this isn't progression. Progression is about doing something new and interesting. Nothing about this track is new or interesting. Becoming more similar to a stock metal band is a change, but in no way a progression. There's no progression in doing something everyone has already done a million times before & that wasn't even interesting to begin with.

    If you want real progression, look at SX at their debut through V. In the debut, they were a band that aped the style of Yngwie Malmsteen with some heavy Queen influences and a little "dark theatrical" atmosphere. By V, they were utterly unique, and made an album with nothing comparable.

    The stuff here certainly has things comparable to it, and do you know why? Because SX is copying the sound of other bands, not forging their own path and making their own identity as they did in the past. What they did from SX to V is progression, changing at each step and becoming more unique in the processes. This is just "fuck it, play some chords and we're done."
     
  8. Sauna

    Sauna Member

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    Not a huge fan of this one based on the first listen. I prefer Nevermore.
     
  9. Progbass

    Progbass Member

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    I think the fact that they are on Nuclear Blast records now could "force" them to make more straightforward songs, what appeal more to the public.

    For example, a ballad from Angra's new album called "Storm of Emotions" is not offering anything new really, but even that song has more interesting use of instruments and melodies than "Without You".

    Its not a bad song, it still sounds like SX, but it probably ends up to be skipped most of the time for me on the album. And I already know that by just listening it for about 3 times.
     
  10. PrgrsveMetalnChains

    PrgrsveMetalnChains Vocal Prince

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    I think for me, it's not the song that is actually progressive in form that I am referring to. To me, this song hits a sweet spot that I think will benefit and suit the band well that they have not done to this level just yet. Writing a more simplistic, possibly radio friendly song IMHO is refreshing to me and I think that's what attracts me to it. It's a break from the Iconoclast/Domination heaviness and intricate style of playing. For once it seems, I'm able to not dissect the track for all its flaws and riffs and time changes and just enjoy a very well written, great song.

    It seems like new territory for the band to keep it simple, but still very powerful emotionally (for me) and still be able to maintain what makes the band who they are. I will admit being that we have all waited for new tracks from the band for so long, it likely influences my "want" to like the track more than normal, but it's whatever. I think Russell's non-aggressive vocal performance and his style in general is what sets this band apart from other modern metal acts. I think if another band were to write or cover this song with any other vocalist it would not have near the same effect whatsoever. It's the soul of a vocalist that you feel with certain bands and songs, and I feel any other vocalist would just "sing" the track - not bleed emotion into it as Russ does in many of his tracks. That's what is so attracting with this band, is that there's a level of emotionalism I feel that is captured that other bands fail to achieve.

    Who knows - this could turn out to be the worst track on the album, but if that's the case I can't wait for the rest!
     
  11. intergalactic

    intergalactic Member

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    please,take any ballad from any other metal band (for example,the one in the last kamelot) ,do you really think is better than "without you" ? I think that sx fans are too well addicted to their ballads,I know they did better,but this one is getting more audience and I think that will reach more fans,so let'see until the record is out.For me is good and I keep on listening it without getting tired
     
  12. PrgrsveMetalnChains

    PrgrsveMetalnChains Vocal Prince

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    I think Eyeballkid had a good word for it. Other bands fail to hit that "magic" mark that infects so many fans and creates that atmosphere that so many songs prior to this one have done. I saw a Youtube comment that made sense which said: "This is gorgeous , non that complex lyrics or melody but for fuck sake as long as the resoult is this smooth and fluid i am gonna give it a thumb up..... this song is amazing nothing seems forced, looks like the whole song made itself without any sort of constriction". It's not complex. Just a smooth track that really comes together well, which is why I think Romeo said it well regarding how the album is "about the song".

    I think bands like Kamelot are great, but I will say where almost all other vocalists fall short is the lack of pure emotion in their voice. Sure, hit all the notes flawlessly, it sounds great, but I want to hear soul and feeling in the vocals. That's what makes great bands stand out more than others.
     
  13. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    I haven't listened to the new Kamelot, but sure, Kamelot's more "stock" ballads are comparable. I'd say things like Don't You Cry and Sailorman's Hymn are actually a lot better than this one. I can't speak for newer Kamelot.

    Part of the magic is crafting songs no one else could make, that take you out of the present. Could another band make Through the Looking Glass or Candlelight Fantasia? No. Could another band make this track? Yes. Any competent modern metal band could.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is, it's delusional to think there's anything special about this track.
     
  14. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    I haven't heard the post-Kahn albums, but it's definitely not obvious that Allen is a better or more emotional vocalist than Kahn. As for the Seventh Wonder guy they've got now (I forgot his name), it's hard to listen to something like the opening to The Great Escape and say that SX has had anything even resembling that performance in their last few albums. Something like Rediscovery or The Edge of Forever, sure.

    --

    There really are a lot of bands out there making great music. You don't have to hold onto SX's new music if you don't want to. Some bands get less interesting over time. It's not because the members are any worse -- just look at LePond and Pinnella's great solo albums they just released. It's probably for a number of reasons. But when it happens, all this rationalization about it is just weird to me. If any other band released this song, no one would even notice, let alone say it was the greatest thing ever. It was practically made on a conveyor belt...

    Anyway that is my piece on this. Nothing else to be said, and I'm not going to try to stop people from enjoying it.
     
  15. EyeballKid

    EyeballKid Shyamalan'd

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    While I agree that Russell has more soul to his voice, I think both Kamelot singers deliver an epic truck of emotion. I'd say they sing with equal (and sometimes more) emotion than Russell, but Russell still has more "soul quality" (as in literal soul music) to his voice.


    I like Without You, but I think Kamelot has written some far superior ballads, Sailorman's Hymn being chief among them. But, they also established themselves as a band who made ballads from day one, whereas until recently Symphony X mixed ballad moments with heavier, more progressive moments.

    Agreed. Russell sounds great here, but I don't get the same emotional response that I got from those old songs. Khan and Tommy Karevik are both fantastic, incredibly emotive vocalists. Comparisons are bound to happen, but all three of these guys are in the top of their field.
     
  16. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

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    Well...Shades of Grey. :)
     
  17. EyeballKid

    EyeballKid Shyamalan'd

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    No, no, we don't talk about that one...
     
  18. Durakonis

    Durakonis Zudviz

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    I think this is a very well done song, in its own right. It is also a hard song to compose, if not to play. (Only the solo section is hard to play I think). Being able to write such melodies is one thing; and arranging them craftily like this, and singing, playing and producing such a song in a convincing and with a soulful manner is another...
     
  19. nckissfan

    nckissfan Civil War reenactor

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    I think it is a really good song. Has a nice balance.
     
  20. symphonyXjapan

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    I think it was decent. It was nice to hear something where the instruments weren't constantly dolting out noise just to be loud. I could tell at moments they were really trying to bring a little bit of that "prog jam" sound back to the fold. LePond had a pretty groovy lead bass during certain moments, and Romeo even had a couple of rythmic guitar parts that were kind of basic but different from his usual. Big thing is I think Pinella could have put forth a lot of his playing talents to make it great.

    Overall though I totally understand where those that say "typical middle of the album ballad" that most metal bands do nowadays are coming from. At the end of the day they at least had some of that SyX stamp in it like with the acoustic guitar doodling and solo (although they were derivative of older songs).
     

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