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Non-Weebo Chill Bros Anime Thread

Discussion in 'In Flames' started by eochaid, Nov 26, 2016.

  1. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    What they did, here in Spain was, instead of cutting those scenes, they mistranslated them (of course, on purpose) for less "harmful" sentences.
     
  2. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    13.jpg 14.jpg

    This scene... For example. The lines "you have no balls" were changed by "why are you screaming?" This way, the whole joke about Bulma thinking that they have lost the dragon balls makes no sense.

    This is just a small example of stupid censorship.
     
  3. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I imagine you guys still got a lot less censorship than we did. I think I read that scene was censored in some way in almost all territories outside of Japan.

    I know that when DBZ first started airing in the US & UK they literally wouldn't even let the characters say "die", "death", "kill", etc. It was changed to sending people to "the next dimension" or "another dimension". Interestlingly, watching with the Japanese subs, they actually reference a 'next dimension' fairly often too - referring to the afterlife, I guess. But of course they also mentioning killing, dying, etc, which the English dub wasn't allowed to do until near the end of the Freeza saga. Even when Vegeta and Nappa were blowing up cities during the Saiyan saga they would insert lines about the cities being 'evacuated' or the buildings being empty 'because it's Sunday'.

    With all of that said, none of that stuff bothered me as a kid when I first watched it. I only learned about it when I was much older.

    As an aside, I'm watching the Future of Trunks TV special at the moment and I can say there is one part where the English dub actually improves hugely on the Japanese version. The scene where Gohan dies is done extremely well, and they licensed a song by a band called Slaughter which fits the scene absolutely perfectly. Better than the original score. In terms of the script, in the original Trunks just repeats "Gohan-san" over and over again, and at one point says "it can't be". That's all. The English dub gives him a more complex internal monologue. In this instance I think both work fine. In the English version it would have been a bit strange for Trunks to just repeat "Gohan" over and over again (also the lip flaps wouldn't sync due to the "-san" added to the end of the Japanese name), whereas in the Japanese version (and in Japanese anime in general) it's quite common for characters to repeat or say names to convey happiness, shock, anger, etc. It isn't really something that's done in English media - not to the same degree, anyway. If you've watched dubbed/subbed anime you'll know what I mean. I don't know if it's the same for Spanish dubs.



    I mean, for a company that got so much of the original DBZ dub wrong, it's kind of amazing how well they did this scene. They actually licensed a bunch of Dream Theatre songs for the movie as well, for some reason.

    I don't know much about Slaughter but Prelude is a pretty awesome piece of instrumental music.



    Slaughter themselves are apparently a glam metal band... from the same album...



    Not really my kind of thing, but it's okay I guess. Kind of funny though, as Prelude doesn't really seem to fit with the album itself.
     
    #263 DE4life, Sep 4, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2021
  4. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    I'm not a big fan of the Japanese dub. Goku, as an adult, with his child voice? No! I don't buy that.

    In Spain, censorship was about sexual things like my previous example. Luckily, some of that was redubbed and one guy also did some version, for download, without censorship.

    About the after life, I guess that's natural if we have in mind the lore of the story. So, I guess, what they did with the English dub is ok.

    This also reminds me how useless Goku's deads became in the end. The same as him becoming a super Saiyan. Being death or being a super means nothing now.
     
  5. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    One of the biggest issues with the original English dub was the insistence on changing dialogue, and also adding dialogue where there wasn't any before. The Japanese DBZ has a lot more silence than the English version, where they feel the need to fill every scene with either rock music or dialogue. You can see it even in the History of Trunks clip.

    The dialogue is changed as:

    00:34
    Dub: Oh no... no...
    Original: Gohan-San...

    00:52
    Dub: Gohan, why'd you have to do it? Why'd you have to leave me? It's not fair.
    Original: Gohan-san... Gohan-san... Gohan-san...

    01:12
    Dub: Oh gosh, no... what'd they do to you Gohan?
    Original: Gohan-san... (in the original there is silence after the camera pans down)

    01:20
    Dub: You were my best friend, you were everything to me... everything
    Original: Gohan-san... (in the original there is silence until the shot of Trunks speaking)

    01:32
    Dub: This just isn't fair. Gohan, Gohan, Gohan!
    Original: It can't be!

    Now, in this instance I actually don't have a problem with what they did here. I think the English version is more emotional, but the 'emptiness' of the Japanese version and Trunks just repeatedly thinking/saying Gohan's name really emphasises how Trunks is in total shock. In the English version he's thinking coherently enough to have an inner monologue, but in the Japanese version he's so stunned that he can barely think or say anything other than Gohan's name. The tone of the scene between both is completely different, and this happens a lot in the original English dub. However, in this instance the music saved that scene. If it was generic synth/rock music it would have been far less impactful, although I think Trunks' English VA does a very good job in that scene and his scream at the end is actually better than the Japanese VA. It might be the best one in the entire English dub, actually.

    Now, in a case where the dialogue is totally different and shit:



    I won't go through it line-by-line, but none of this is in the original. No bizarre "cat loves food, yeah yeah yeah" song, Bulma isn't calling Yamcha a "goof" or a "nut" and she never mentions dreaming about Vegeta. When she's looking up at the sky the dub suggests she's thinking about Vegeta, but in the original, although she mentions Vegeta, she explicitly says that it's Goku she's worrying about.

    So yeah, the English dub just took huge liberties with the scripts and sometimes changed them entirely. It got better during the Cell Games/Buu saga, but there's a lot of nonsense before that. The only positive is that when they released the DVD season sets they actually went back and re-dubbed a lot of the older material to make it more accurate, improve the VA performances and take out a lot of the stupidity. Not all of it, but a decent amount. The above scene in the re-dub is completely different and much closer to the original script.
     
  6. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    Changing dialogues is bad when there's censorship but is even worse when there's not because that makes no sense. I'm also not sure that is legal under the terms on which they sold the show for distribution in the UK (I mean the Japanese company).

    The silences... My guess is that they did not understand those silences or that they were making them feel uncomfortable. Maybe, there's too much "noise" in the western productions. Specially when they're intended for children.
     
  7. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I believe the head of Funimation (US distributor) was a relation of some kind to an executive at Toei, which is why Funimation, which was a very small company at the time, got rights to DBZ in the first place.

    As far as I can tell Toei, at the time, didn't really care how the series was dealt with outside of Japan. They would, i think, have just assumed any changes made were done to better localise the series to a Western audience. I mean, the dub got some things entirely wrong (for example, Vegeta tells Goku his father was a 'brilliant scientist' in the dub) and that was very early on, so if Toei cared they would have done something about it then. It seems like as long as they were paid for the series rights, they weren't concerned with how the licensee translated or produced the dub in the end.

    There's a Malaysian company called 'Speedy' which dubbed a bunch of the movies into English. Other than the dialogue being completely wrong and terrible, they even got the names of characters completely incorrect in some of the movies. For example, in the Bojack Unbound movie:

    Goku = Gohan
    Trunks = Dorangaso
    Piccolo = Uncle Motong
    Tenshinhan = Dough
    King Kai = Gay King (lol)
    Krillin = Infinite Hands (wtf)
    Muten Roshi = Mr. Poy
    Bojack = King Bogo

    So... I have to assume once the license for DBZ is paid for Toei don't care at all what happens next!
     
  8. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    :unsure:This happened in Spain. When Naruto, finally, arrived here, it was the american version. Which meant american (awfull) intros and endings and lots of censorship. This and the dub was really, really bad. Things were so bad, and Naruto was so well known, that people started throwing shit at the show, for good reasons. When news of this reached to the Japanese company, they said that they were going to make sure that the right version of the show would reach to Spain. Well, the dub is still shit but we have the right show now, with the right intros and without any kind of censorpship.

    What's the difference? Naruto started airing in a moment when fansubs were the main source of anime for the most of the world, and people new the show far before it came to the west. While, when DB started, internet wasn't still a thing so people couldn't knwo that there was a difference. And, I guess, now people has grown accustomed to that adultered version so they don't raise complaints or don't think that is a big deal. You should probably be having a different version if the anime started airing 20 years before it did.
     
  9. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    Well, eventually there were some improvements. There was enough backlash from fans who did know about the original show that Funimation ended up producing 'uncut' DVDs removing a lot of the censorship, and eventually included the Japanese audio with subtitles. They also re-dubbed a lot of their previous work for the DVD season releases in the mid-2000s, which did improve the original dub somewhat. I don't think they were under any pressure from Toei to do any of this, though.

    Interestingly when they dubbed Dragon Ball Z: Kai in 2010 it was much, much better than their original DBZ dub. They kept the Japanese music, were much more faithful to the original script and had much improved performances from the voice actors. Also the intros were the same as the Japanese version, just translated to English. So, in some way we did eventually get a good dub of the show, even if it was the Kai version. Personally I'm not interested in watching the dub at this point, so it doesn't matter to me, but it's nice for the people who did want a decent English version of the show.
     
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  10. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    Internet is a blessing in that way. Once that we have access to the original information, and the fansubs started creating far better versions of the shows than the companies who own the rights of distribution, they were left with no other choice than to improve their releases.

    What toei does with DB is just mikling the cow. Now they're releasing a blu ray version that, most probably and the same that happened to the dvd version, will only, slightly, improve the quality of the images.

    DB is a series that deserve better than that. But, again, when I see what Shueisha and Toeiyama are doing with it... The quality of the new manga, in terms of drawings and story is really poor. DB is, now, a cheap show and manga that's giving an insane amount of money to their creators. There are other series that have received more love from the people involved in them.
     
  11. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I haven't seen the new manga, but the Dragon Ball Super anime just looks... plastic? Fake? Something like that. For me the original series and traditional anime drawing looks far better than however they are animating the new series.

    But yes, at this point it's very much squeezing every last drop of money out of Dragon Ball fans. I don't plan to watch any of Super once I'm done with the original series.
     
  12. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    You can do a quick search on Google. Is not awful. Is just someone copying the worse drawings from Akira Toeiyama.
     
  13. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    Some new series I downloaded and have added to my watch list, after finishing DBZ:

    Tokyo Ghoul
    Masamune-kun no Revenge (Masamune-Kun's Revenge)
    Golden Boy
    Yakusoku no Neverland (The Promised Neverland) - only Season 1, apparently Season 2 doesn't follow the manga and it sucks.
    Sora Yori mo Tooi Basho (A Place Further than the Universe)

    Most of these are quite well regarded, but I only downloaded Masamune-Kun's Revenge as I had for some reason saved it as a tab on my phone over a year ago and can't remember why. Presumably there was something about it that I wanted to see, but can't remember what.
     
    #273 DE4life, Sep 16, 2021
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2021
  14. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    Just a warning. Masamune Kun doesn't have a proper ending.

    Golden boy was funny (and echii).

    I recommend the two seasons from the Eccentric Family (uchoten kazou or something similar). Als, I finished Gintama. Best Ime ending ever. And I'm watching Fena the Pirate princess and The Idtaen Deities Know Only Peace. Both good shows.

    The rest of the new season is meh.
     
  15. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I finished Golden Boy and I guess it was OK. Certainly a product of its time. I like the older anime drawing style.

    I also watched the first two seasons of Tokyo Ghoul. Good in parts, but not a satisying conclusion to the end of the second season. Apparently the manga is completely different. There's another two seasons which seem to be quite heavily panned and have completely moved on from the first two seasons, so not sure if I'll watch those yet.
     
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  16. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    Golden Boy seems like an excuse for going echii. But, it was fun and hot. And I remembered that I started Tokyo Ghoul s few years ago. I don't know why I never finished it. I probably forgot.
     
  17. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I don't really watch echii stuff which is probably why I was just like... it's OK. Some parts were funny. Others were just weird and a bit creepy (the toilet stuff for example... wtf). From what I've read the manga in Japan was way more explicit than the anime and basically became cartoon porn in the end. The anime almost goes there with the girl and the motorbike, but that's about as far as it goes.

    Tokyo Ghoul has nice visuals, the story is somewhat interesting and the characters are well presented. Unfortunately because each season only has 12 episodes it really doesn't have time to flesh out a lot of the characters, especially in the second season. I still have no idea who some of them were or what their motivations were. The anime doesn't explain it - you have to read the manga to really understand what's going on. In fact, you could argue the anime series is basically an advert to buy the manga, as it leaves so much crucial information out.
     
  18. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    Yes. The manga is more explicit. Though, not more than other mangas that have lewd moments. The story is funny nonsense. I like echii when it's well done, like any other story. Sadly, most of echii is, also, nonsense. An excuse to show boobs.
     
  19. DE4life

    DE4life 'ello treacle

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    I've taken a break from anime and am now watching a bunch of Korean/Japanese dramas on Netflix. Obviously watching them all in the original language with subs, because fuck watching those shows dubbed. So far binged Squid Game, Alice in Borderland, My Name, Move to Heaven, DP and Extracurricular. I think they're all Korean except Alice in Borderland, which is Japanese.

    Squid Game/Alice in Borderland are survival game series, quite different in style and overall theme but both enjoyable.

    My Name is about a girl who's seeking revenge on the guy who killed her dad. Kinda silly in parts and overly depressing at times as well, but still a good watch and the music is really nice.



    This song is basically the leitmotif for the show and has been stuck in my head ever since.

    Move to Heaven is about an autistic boy who ends up living with his young, deadbeat uncle. They run a business which cleans the rooms of dead people, and tells their stories. Actually a really solid series.

    DP is about the experience of being in the South Korean army and is really hard hitting, but well done. Only 6 episodes so doesn't take long to get through. I often forget how common conscription is in other countries. It hasn't been a thing in the UK for a really long time.

    Extracurricular tells a story about a really smart kid who is trying to make enough money to go to college. His parents aren't around so he gets money through offering protection via an app and a bodyguard to girls who do 'compensated dating' - basically prostitutes. As one would expect it eventually gets out of control and shit hits the fan. Another really good watch.

    I might have to take a break for a while though as these series are way too addictive.
     
  20. eochaid

    eochaid Asshole

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    My wife is trying to make me watch some kdramas. So far, just some light comedy drama called Vincenzo or something like that. More comedy than drama. Though every chapter is exaggeratedly long.
     

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