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Religion and Sience

Discussion in 'The Philosopher' started by XxSNAPxX, Sep 8, 2009.

  1. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    True. I personally consider it as beliefs more than practice, i should do both but well.. haha

    :lol:
    ?? There is no "Islamist" lol, there is only Muslim ;)
     
  2. Sepia~

    Sepia~ New Metal Member

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    In fact there are islamists, they are those who believe that a nation needs to work by the laws of Qu'ran to work properly.

    Sorry, I had to.:loco:
     
  3. Silver Incubus

    Silver Incubus Dead Hands Justin

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    I have never understood why anyone should need a book to tell them how to live their lives. Children especially are good modelers of behavior and with the right example of people they can come upon their own morals for behavior on their own without fear of damnation, guilt, and sin, which all can lead to mental health problems like schizophrenia, depression.
     
  4. Sepia~

    Sepia~ New Metal Member

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    Firstly, someone who would follow the Bible blindly and let it tell one how to live couldn't simply live by it because it tells something and then denies or changes it later. Second, I don't fear damnation, guilt or sin, I try to avoid them. The main point is that I believe Christ overcame those things, so I or any other christian wouldn't have to be afraid of them. Of course there are some that have mental health problems due to those three things, but I assume they're a minor part of those with mental health problems..
     
  5. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    Every Muslim country more or less follows the rules of Islam ;)
    Apart from some parts in North Africa i guess.


    I can answer you from a perspective of a group of people making rules found in a book, which is Qur'an.
    Well, in Qur'an, part from the historical events and religious things that it states. It also talks about a lifestyle that leads to success and justice that every Muslim is required to follow (I don't think it's an obligation) as individual as well as a society as a whole, and it's not limited by a place or a specific period of time. And its results led to the rise of the Arab/Muslim world but once they left it, they never reached that point again, to this day.
    I can elaborate more and give more examples and maybe verses from the Qur'an too if you want. :)
     
  6. XxSNAPxX

    XxSNAPxX [HYDRAKUS]

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    Okay...guess i have a couple things to say now.lol.
    To the guy who says i view religion ONLY as praying, wrong, praying is an important part of religion...as it's written. and if your not one of those rule bending christians (you most likely are considering i've never met a STRAIGHT UP christian) you would believe that as long as you worship god as he says to, your prayers will be answered. In your story "God" sent many chances for the priest to be saved, he was just stupid. Where were the chances to save my grandmother??? NOWHERE. okay moving on
    And to he who is trying to understand his religion through his own interpretation of it, thats why i said what i said. your twisting it, subconsciously or otherwise, which ONE is a sin in itself, and TWO only points out that not even the follower can believe all the craziness.
     
  7. monoxide_child

    monoxide_child New Metal Member

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    i went to school with a guy that was raised as a "christian" with him and his parents going to church every single sunday, when he was 14 he realised he was gay, but because his church kept repeating "homosexuality is a sin" he started praying, asking god to turn him straight, he even had sex one time with a female (she was a close friend of mine) and after a few months of agony he killed himself, in the suicide note, he says that it's better for him to die than have sex with another man, (due to police incompetence, me and all his highschool friends actually read his suicide note before his parents did)
    my point here is that religion can cause depression and schizophrenia
     
  8. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    First off, I'm so sorry for what happened to your friend,really.
    Don't generalize man and say "Religion can cause depression and schizophrenia", it sounds like a fact ! I mean, I understand such statement as "Whoever follows religion will experience depression and schizophrenia" which is not true, how many religious people are having a really happy life?

    IMO, what caused depression to your friend is that he believed that homosexuality is a sin and he was a homosexual, therefore, he was seeing himself as a sinner but he couldn't deal with it and feared God's punishment and he chose death rather than sinning.
    His state + the pressure that the priest caused to him result his depression.The guy was already at war with himself so it was a very fragile situation to anyone to deal with. A psychologist would help him contemplating it better than any interference of the priest unless he gently and without scaring the shit out of him explains WHY is it forbidden (unless the priest doesn't know why :lol:) and you can notice the same thing in any form of law, most people (at least here) tend to break the law because they don't know what's the point of it.

    If you consider your religion as wise, you should ask why a particular thing is forbidden.
     
  9. XxSNAPxX

    XxSNAPxX [HYDRAKUS]

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    First off, yes, sorry for your friend. I've seen a couple cases like this in freinds of my own. None have killed themselves but they are all very guilt ridden and such. I believe also that religion and to be more specific, those religions with very strict rules and laws regarding social matters, can and do cause un-needed pain and trauma.
     
  10. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    If a sick murder can't kill anymore coz he found out that his religion forbids him to do so, and he gets an un-needed pain, we blame religion for his bad state yeah? not his habits.
     
  11. monoxide_child

    monoxide_child New Metal Member

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    i didn't mean to say that religion ALWAYS causes depression and schizophrenia

    what i meant to say was that religion HAS THE ABILITY TO cause depression and schizophrenia

    the phrase "a man shal not lie down with another man as he would lie down with a woman" apears in the book of leviticus, and this book is mostly about sanitation/cleanliness/preventing birth-defects
    from a sanitation POV, the phrase "man lie down with another man as he would lie down with a woman" is prolly a reference to penis-in-ass penetration, which could cause both penile infections and rectal infections even if neither person has any kind of "Sexually transmitable infection"
    also, preventing "homosexual activity" was used to make the mono-theistic people breed faster than the pagan people that commonly prcaticed homosexuality/beastiality/heterosexual anal/felatio/cunilingus and other sexual acts that don't involve the possibility of reproduction
     
  12. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    What's this book you are talking about dude? Sorry I'm not familiar with it. But I agree with what you stated about sex ;)
     
  13. XxSNAPxX

    XxSNAPxX [HYDRAKUS]

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    No your taking it out of context. Let me explain, see, the notion is meant only for social trivial matters. Being gay is in no way...against the moreal code of human conduct and as long as your down to earth with it no one will be hurt. killing and stealing and such things are different, when you do these things your directly, negatively affecting the life of another.
     
  14. hexwind

    hexwind Creepiness Och Terrorism

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    Okay. But can't homosexuals hurt the rest of the society indirectly by the diseases they can cause? I have nothing against gays as long as they don't molest on me :lol:
     
  15. BlackMetalWhiteGuy

    BlackMetalWhiteGuy Manly Man!

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    Schizophrenia is a neurological condition that causes one to confuse their internal dialogue for a separate entity and is generally caused by a chemical imbalance, not personal distress.

    The sex issues are very logical though and I'm surprised to have never thought of it before. I'd love to find a source to support it though, can you link to something?
     
  16. XxSNAPxX

    XxSNAPxX [HYDRAKUS]

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    indirectly yes....and i agree...NO MOLESTING
     
  17. derek

    derek Grey Eminence

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    Indeed. I'd love to find the evidence used to break out that little nugget of gold.
     
  18. BlackMetalWhiteGuy

    BlackMetalWhiteGuy Manly Man!

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    No, this is a misconception perpetuated by imperialistic cultures to enforce their own agendas. Homosexuals spread fewer diseases because homosexual encounters are less likely to involve penetration than heterosexual sex is. Homosexuals do have more partners though, but heterosexual couples can actually pass diseases onto their offspring, whereas homosexual couples cannot.

    Another problem with oppressing homosexuals is that it forces them to try to fit in by adopting a heterosexual lifestyle, such as by getting married and having children. However, these men are still likely to seek sex with other men covertly, which is how diseases spread between heterosexual and homosexual cultures. In this case, it is the actions of the oppressed homosexual that contribute to the "cross contamination," but it is the oppressive heterosexual society that is ultimately responsible.
     
  19. Resonator

    Resonator Member

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    Well, he says it is a neurological condition, whereas the problem lies in confusing it with real. It is real, and it is a neurological condition. Therefore, accepting that it's just a part of their life now is a good response to such a condition. As this imbalance is not deadly, perhaps not enough research is done in the psychological implications of making an enemy with something that isn't a problem in the first place.

    Perhaps it just creates another unnecessary imbalance that continues the "insanity" rather than end it. I notice schizo's don't get better with the current method, they just bypass it.

    In other words, I don't see how Schizophrenia requires people being locked in a mental institution when the solution is self evident. Oh yeah, doctors want people to be sick so they can keep their job. Plus the whole fear of abnormality thing.

    Look at religion. The main part people hate is being told that they'll go to hell if they don't be good. Well, let's take a look at the mental institution. If you're not normal, you're going to the psych ward. We're already comfortable with one method of establishing control, and you'll notice people more inclined to say that about themselves are the vast majority of America.

    Is it ok to let one mindset rule the United States and not the other? Science before Religion? How about neither? Both? They say separate church from state, I say they only say that to shield you from the truth.
     
  20. BlackMetalWhiteGuy

    BlackMetalWhiteGuy Manly Man!

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    He wasn't asking about Schizophrenia, he was seconding my request for a source to back up monoxide_child's information about the origins of Christian sexual oppression.
     

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