This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.

I Want You!

Join Symphony X and discover tons of other great Metal forums, sign up today!

religion

Discussion in 'Symphony X (Unofficial)' started by Phanto, Jul 15, 2012.

  1. metalxmetalx

    metalxmetalx Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2011
    Messages:
    310
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    18
    The title of this thread is misleading, you know. It should have been entitled MYTHOLOGY because that’s what all religions are. I read a book by Joseph Campbell called “The Masks of God: Occidental Mythology” in which the author shows how ancient mythologies give rise to new ones in an intertwined dance since the human race first appeared on this planet. Occidental Mythology is the third part of a tetralogy.

    Campbell’s description of his work sounds like a music review to me:

    "Its main result for me has been the confirmation of a thought I have long and faithfully entertained: of the unity of the race of man, not only in its biology, but also in its spiritual history, which has everywhere unfolded in the manner of a single symphony, with its themes announced, developed, amplified and turned about, distorted, reasserted, and today, in a grand fortissimo of all sections sounding together, irrestibly advancing to some kind of mighty climax, out of which the next great movement will emerge."
     
  2. Wander

    Wander 10+2=6

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    2,070
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Finland
    What I believe Phanto is trying to say is that Nordic countries are actually basically post-christian; most people are still members of the church, but nobody actually goes to church. It's all just tradition. Religion is not an issue that is discussed in politics (or every day life) as I believe it is in the US.

    One example of this tradition thing would be the fact that at 14 I went to confirmation school, which is part of the Finnish Lutheran thing to become a full member of the church or whatever, although I had already been an atheist for years. In fact, I believe my mother was as well, but she thought it would be too shocking for my older relatives if I did not go to the confirmation seremony. Besides, it's like graduating. You get lots of money so it's worth it.

    I haven't been to a church since. Finally, after turning 18, I just left the church just like my older siblings had done. The funny thing is that a lot of my mates who had no more faith than I did are still members of the church just because of the tradition. They haven't been to a church since either, but just don't see enough reason to leave the organization. To me, the 2% (I think?) taxation was enough, but I guess they have some sort of silly belief that giving money to the church helps the poor or something. I don't know, maybe it does, but there are more direct routes...

    E: spelling
     
  3. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Man I'm mad jelly of you folks in Scandinavia, but I don't know if my brown Californian ass could handle the cold. In the more liberal parts of California religion isn't such a thing, but that usually comes in the form of PC crap or whiny "new atheists." I'd love to live in a place where there simply wasn't any religion and it wasn't a big deal that there wasn't.
     
  4. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    Try living in the fucking middle east. :lol:

    Well actually I'm in the near east and probably the most moderate country there (even our 'islamists' refused to apply sharia law, and we have a lot of islamophobes). But it still sucks to have to live among so many deeply indoctrinated people.

    @Phanto: Okay gotcha.

    I just don't buy into the whole coming up with new modified 'softer' versions of the actual religions. You either follow the religion's official texts exactly as they are (and be an idiot forever) or quit. Most indoctrinated people I know don't really completely follow their own religion as it clearly says it should be followed, and yet they won't hesitate to preach and judge you for not conforming to their beliefs. The original texts themselves contain some obvious contradictions which they somehow just pretend don't exist. And whenever there are new social/scientific/etc developments they'll just "curve fit" their religion to these new developments (even if they are in contradiction) instead of just admitting their faith is for the most part merely the mythology of an ancient society, one reflecting its fears, its hopes, its need to fill the void created by its ignorance, its complexes, its need to enslave and dominate, its need to conquer and expand, and so on.

    Btw, I have nothing against figures like Jesus. I personally admire them and find them to be quite impressive people (and those who disagree probably would have never had the ability or balls to do what these people did in societies as stupid as the ones they lived in). It's their generations of fans and their tendency to twist, to misunderstand, and to never ask the right questions and seek to learn from their gifted master instead of projecting their own misconceptions on his teachings. That's what the problem mostly was (although for those of such figures who broke the rule of silence and deliberately chose to create a religion, I can't help but feel they should have known better).

    Take somebody like Jesus for example. One of his gifts was his extreme empathy (something the collective consciousness of humanity lacked and still lacks). He embodied a kind of love unknown to mankind, a universal kind of love. He tried to teach that through inspiration, but the fact was, in ALL of the time his disciples got to spend with him, not a single one of them ever asked him the question "How do I love as you love?". They just followed, admired and glorified the guy but never sought to become what he is themselves, which was what he intended. But you can never truly teach someone something they are not willing or ready to learn. The result is nothing really changing. For instance women are still seen the same way in society, the collective skills for diplomacy and ability to empathize with other human beings is still as severely lacking (despite what the church says, which btw I think considering its history should just shut up), and so on. Except of course a religion being created. A religion that was and is just an old mirror reflecting what those people thought, with mere hints to what the man actually embodied and what he wanted people to seek to become.

    Sorry for the long'ish post.
     
  5. Phanto

    Phanto Alalalalalalalala.

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,761
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Gothenburg, SWE
    Jesus has some pretty sweet fiction around him, that's for sure.
     
  6. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    That's because it's not all fiction.
     
  7. Sauna

    Sauna Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2010
    Messages:
    385
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Sweet fiction indeed. Jesus as portrayed in the New Testament and Milton's Satan are among the coolest characters ever.
     
  8. UnholyCrusada

    UnholyCrusada Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2009
    Messages:
    260
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I agree 110%. I was raised Catholic, but after doing some research I have come to the realization that Christianity has very few, if any, original ideas. It's a snowball that rolled over practically every popular religion that had existed prior to or at the time of it's inception. The story of the birth, death, and resurrection of Christ in particular borrows heavily from ancient Egyptian and Greek mythology (the stories of Osiris and Dionysus to be specific, not to mention the ancient pagan deity Mithras). The act of communion was lifted directly from earlier pagan religions, as was the weekly holy day, etc.

    There's much more, but I don't want to sound like a textbook.
     
  9. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    "Hardcore" atheists and religious people are both equally misguided.
     
  10. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I don't know about misguided, but the "Brights" anyway seem to treat it like some thing, you know - do you want a cookie or a medal for figuring out that fundamentalist Christianity is hokum and moderate Christianity is tepid? I mean, is it hard to do that? It seems like reasonable people already figured it out and are living their lives without religion getting all up in their jim-jams. :err:
     
  11. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    lol, totally.
     
  12. Phanto

    Phanto Alalalalalalalala.

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,761
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Gothenburg, SWE
    How do you know?
     
  13. Wander

    Wander 10+2=6

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    2,070
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Finland
    Yeah, I don't think there are too many non-religious texts written near the time Jesus supposedly lived that mention him. It is even possible that the guy never existed. Even if he did, his character has been twisted shitloads, that's for sure.
     
  14. Xtopher

    Xtopher Creation's menace

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2003
    Messages:
    307
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Linköping, Sweden
    I worship Santa...

    i made you misread, sucker.
     
  15. donKyle

    donKyle Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2011
    Messages:
    573
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Texas
    Yes you did! I read 'fucker' instead of 'sucker'


     
    #35 donKyle, Jul 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 20, 2015
  16. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    :lol:

    Nonsense.
     
  17. Postulate

    Postulate Have a nice day! :)

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2008
    Messages:
    1,474
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Oh boy, Islam.
     
  18. donKyle

    donKyle Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2011
    Messages:
    573
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Texas
    Lol yeah idk.

    So which religion is the most ridiculous/stupid/etc? Don't say all of them! You can only pick 1! Muahahahaha

    I've always thought mormons were pretty weird.
     
  19. Liquid Tension

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    2,218
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    38
    It was Aliens that visited and tricked the population to think they were gods....

    Just saying...
     
  20. Marwen

    Marwen Five Align

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Messages:
    1,533
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    Location:
    Atlantis
    Contemporary ones? Scientology. lol

    Anabaptism too (what the Amish are into).

    I think it's safe to assume the chance of religion being the result of human idiocy is quite higher than it being the result of an extraterrestrial species that evolved that went so far in evolution without destroying itself.

    I guess the next question should be: What is more stupid, religions or conspiracy theories? Tough one if you ask me.
     

Share This Page