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The Official Movie Thread

Discussion in 'GMD Social Forum' started by Manic Ferocity, May 4, 2007.

  1. RadicalThrasher

    RadicalThrasher Active Member

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    #16681 RadicalThrasher, Oct 13, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
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  2. zabu of nΩd

    zabu of nΩd Free Insultation

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    I saw Joker yesterday. The plot had quite a bit of cliche, but I liked the mood/atmosphere, and loved Phoenix's acting. I don't think you can expect the world from a movie whose goal is to create a plausible backstory for a cheesy comic book villain. They did a pretty good job for what they were working with.

    Not saying you're wrong, but I wouldn't have singled Arthur's lines out of a list of criticisms. He's supposed to be an awkward guy who sucks at expressing himself. He can't exactly be full of wit.
     
    #16682 zabu of nΩd, Oct 13, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  3. Einherjar86

    Einherjar86 Active Member

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    That's a fair point, but the Joker is supposed to be full of wit. I guess you can say they took it a different direction, and if that's the case then I'm simply not a fan of this portrayal.

    That's probably closer to my broader critique, which I didn't have time to get into earlier. The Joker's eventually mythic rise is based on his status as a supergenius, albeit a nihilistic one. This film demythologizes him, making his rise out to be little more than a series of accidents. I simply found it to be a less compelling and self-apologetic narrative structure. It felt lazy to me, although I certainly see the appeal in an accident-driven narrative.

    Also, I wish they'd played up the class warfare issue, specifically as it pertains to Arthur and the Waynes. Batman's main superhero ability is that he's a billionaire; the Joker's is that he has, almost literally, nothing. Joker nods to that dynamic but doesn't play it up. It could have been an impressive critique but never really gets there. And what's with the age difference between Arthur and Bruce?

    tl;dr, Heath Ledger was a much better Joker--but that's largely because Christopher Nolan is much better director than Todd Phillips.
     
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  4. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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  5. Funerary_Doom

    Funerary_Doom My head is bloody, but unbowed.

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    **Not really a spoiler but if you haven't seen the Joker don't read**




    I saw Joker yesterday, and I was telling my boyfriend I didn't like this Joker because he seemed "weak" to me. However, I used the wrong word. It's not "weak" persay... but all "interesting" qualities that we all know the Joker for having, seemed like this character lacked them (I thought Phoenix's acting was great but the screenplay's approach was obviously very different). Despite feeling a whole lot of sympathy for this character and could understand why he became what he became.... I was missing the witty and unpredictable charm that the Joker typically has. What made Heath Ledger's Joker memorable was you sympathized without knowing his full story. He was THAT fucked up. I don't want to see someone get trampled on over and over again for 2 hours, until they break. It's a bit too predictable and rational for the Joker's character, imo.
     
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  6. Einherjar86

    Einherjar86 Active Member

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    (no real spoilers here, but I guess don't read if you want to know as little as possible about the movie)

    I think a lot of it has to with the demands placed on an "origin story." What made Ledger's Joker so much better in The Dark Knight was that he has no origin. And in that sense, he becomes emblematic of the unconscious desires, tendencies, and impulses that all humans struggle with. He works simultaneously as an antagonist and a symbolic figure.

    Like you say, by presenting an origin story, Joker attempts to offer a rational narrative behind Arthur's descent; but in doing so, it deprives the Joker of everything that makes him a fascinating character.
     
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  7. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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    Can't wait to see Joker.

    Watching:

    xcv.jpg
     
  8. rms

    rms Active Member

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    Feel like you could say this thing about the way movies have been written for twenty years and why they're trash.
     
  9. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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    I haven't seen it yet but it seems obvious to me from all the interviews I've read that Todd Phillips is less concerned with making a canonical comic book movie and more concerned with subverting the current trend of comic book movies to direct a love-letter to 70's/80's cinematic character studies. He's been banging the "Taxi Driver/King of Comedy/Serpico/Raging Bull are my influences" drum since the film was announced.

    I know I haven't seen it yet but this is my expectation going in, and I don't think it was a mere coincidence that Todd chose to depict his Joker as a clown rather than the way more common jester. Seems like an attempt to concretely separate his character from all the others, and clowns unlike jesters which are historically meant to speak truth to power in a comical context (hence the wit) clowns are just there to be mocked and to entertain plebs, though he also obviously jacked much of his story from The Killing Joke.
     
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  10. RadicalThrasher

    RadicalThrasher Active Member

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    Watching

    [​IMG]


     
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  11. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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  12. Einherjar86

    Einherjar86 Active Member

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    Say what specifically?
     
  13. Blurry_Dreams

    Blurry_Dreams Active Member

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    Crispin's face is perfect for this role
     
  14. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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    Planning to also watch Dogville a bit later on, it's a Kidman day.

    sg.gif
     
  15. RadicalThrasher

    RadicalThrasher Active Member

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  16. no country for old wainds

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    then do eyes wide shut and the killing of a sacred deer and stoker imho
     
  17. rms

    rms Active Member

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    over explain rather than leave to doubt
     
  18. CiG

    CiG Harbinger of Metal

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    I've seen the first two, but never even heard of Stoker.
     
  19. no country for old wainds

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    it’s by the oldboy dude, didn’t get much hype but i liked it as a hitchcock pastiche kinda thing
     
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  20. challenge_everything

    challenge_everything Active Member

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    Yeah Stoker is cool.
     

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