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The (Un)official write anything you want page

Discussion in 'RC' started by circus_brimstone, Jan 8, 2006.

  1. KILL TULLY

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  2. dorian gray

    dorian gray Returning videotapes

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    Im not sure what youre asking. You implied that no "progress" ever arose from changing the Constitution. I countered with the notion that the abolition of slavery would be considered, in the minds of educated and intelligent persons, progress. Slavery, while not mentioned in the literal sense, was a concept built into the Constitution by the Founding Fathers as a means of building this country.
     
  3. KILL TULLY

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    It was a concept in their mind, yes. It is still unconstitutional. 'Slavery' is not mentioned a single time in the constitution. It is hinted at though; you are right. I would still argue that slavery was unconstitutional from the get-go (people much smarter than myself and more knowledgeable on the subject would/have as well).


    I believe the only example of actually negating/changing the constitution is the Twenty-first Amendment to the United States Constitution. I could very well be wrong though and would be interested to find out.
     
  4. einride

    einride your best friend

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    im sorry i dont really care to have a strong opinion about most of this but it doesn't really help your case to throw around the word "socialist" like it actually applied to anyone here

    i'm sure there are valid arguments to be made but "we are not SOCIALIST, therefore:" is the weakest and most misguided shit


    also
    yes it should not ever be the purpose of government to keep its populace comfortable and safe, what is this horseshit
     
  5. KILL TULLY

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    That's not how America works. For instance my state (Massachusetts) has socialized-health care, higher taxes, more variety of taxes than other states, etc. I'm not 'throwing the word around', I'm using it in it's literal sense.


    The only purpose of the United States Federal Government is to enforce the constitution and maintain the military (who's job is to 'support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic') . Through this they allow the people the ability to keep themselves comfortable and safe.


    Again: We are a very, very different place than the rest of the world. You may think us crazy/stupid, hate us for it, etc. but it's still the truth.
     
  6. thebaron

    thebaron Member

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    Hail Tully! :kickass:

    :wave:

    I'm in a technology company office full of engineers, there are multiple concealed carry license holders with weapons on them in the office. I have zero fear. Live free or die.
     
  7. einride

    einride your best friend

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    ok, that is kind of fair enough. i tend to read "state" as "sovereign country" and somehow took it as an attack on those of us living in SOCIALIST SWEDEN or COMMUNIST FRANCE or whatever, so never mind

    although it is pretty extreme to call an entire american state "socialist" because they have some manner of public health care. not exactly what "socialism" means to the rest of the world


    so in essence, one of the purposes of your government is to try as best as it can (within the confines of an 18th century framework) to keep you comfortable and safe then?

    it just sounds really funny that you're using the words as if safety and comfort are somehow not desirable things


    no, i understand that, and i have full respect for you for sticking to your guns (har-dee-har-har)

    personally i'm happy to live in a place where the risk of getting shot or subjected to violent crime is almost nil, but as you say, we have an entirely different history and mindset compared to you guys

    so yeah, keep on truckin'
     
  8. KILL TULLY

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    Socialist-'esque' enough here in America, though.


    Nope, it's just to support the constitution. The people should be in charge of their own comfort and safety beyond that.

    They are desirable, but they aren't the MOST desirable.
     
  9. Dick Sirloin

    Dick Sirloin please... stay safe

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    Pit-bulls do not exist for the sole purpose of killing/violence.


    I live in a redneck, gun-crazy state called North Carolina. I know a shitload of this type of people personally. Some of them are even friends and family. Yes, I am stereotyping here. But so are you--blaming the "librul media" for something that for a TON of people is simple common sense.


    Can you tell me why ANY civilian should own a Bushmaster .223? The SOLE purpose of this weapon is to kill a fuckload of people. If it has another purpose, then I would genuinely like to know.


    Also, you can't tell me that FREEDOM is the main reason to regulate guns better. Do we not have limits on free speech in this country, i.e. burning an American flag? Do we not have limits on who can drive a vehicle, and what kind, i.e. a civilian can't drive a tank to work? Do we not have limits on what you can look at, i.e. kiddie porn? Face it, this country has a LOT of limitations on so-called "freedom." And most of them are necessary,
     
  10. KILL TULLY

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    Awesome man; you mean that not all gun owners are 'inbred tobacco spittin' red neck small-penised psychopath idiots' or whatever people were saying in previous pages? I AM SHOCKED!
     
  11. Dick Sirloin

    Dick Sirloin please... stay safe

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    Not all. Just most.
     
  12. einride

    einride your best friend

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    but they wouldn't have written the constitution the way they did if they had no regard for your comfort or safety, though
     
  13. KILL TULLY

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    Do enlighten me on what pit-bulls were bred for than?

    (I love them, by the way).



    I'm not sure were I ever stereotyped anyone or mentioned the 'librul media'. Please quote me so I can apologize and correct my mistake if I did so.




    That's not type of gun: that's a manufacturer and a caliber of round. Assuming you mean an AR-15; plenty of people hunt with them.

    Explain to me how having a weapon that is efficient at killing people is somehow against the 2nd Amendment?

    It doesn't matter anyways; I will never be able to convince you.

    I can't even begin to comprehend why you think American citizens shouldn't be able to have them; so we are even I guess.


    No, we don't have that limit.

    Please look here, read a few other countries views/laws, and than scroll to the United States: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_desecration

    I believe the only limits to the 1st Amendment are those revolving around obscenity and pornography; which are totally irrelevant as counter-points seeing as I think they are also ridiculous and unconstitutional laws. I obviously don't support that; so using it in an argument against me won't work.


    You can drive whatever you want on your own property.

    And I don't see why a civilian wouldn't be able to drive a tank to work?

    Kiddie porn is so obviously anti-constitutional I don't think it deserves an argument.
     
  14. thebaron

    thebaron Member

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    :D

    It's funny how different the mentality is here. My liberal leaning girlfriend argues for the right to carry. I know flaming gays who visit the Sig Sauer Academy. It's ingrained in NH culture, the only ones who can't stand it are usually MA transplants who came here thinking it was VT.

    From my perspective I only worry about guns in the hands of the mentally ill and participants in our culture's cancers (gang banging rap culture, meth culture, etc). And even then the chance of being involved in any gun related violence is so tiny I hardly think about it. We should focus on eliminating the problems causing people to become motivated to use their weapons for senseless violence if anything.

    On another note, what is 'progress'? I see it being thrown around in this thread... but I'm not sure what we are progressing too. I've asked this of self defined 'progressives' but they don't seem to have an answer outside of the issue du jour.
     
  15. thebaron

    thebaron Member

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    You're just thinking of the wildly vocal ones and the stereotypes. Most gun owners do not make it known.
     
  16. KILL TULLY

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    They wrote it specifically so that the people had control of their own fate, comfort, safety, life, etc. not the federal government.


    So you are half right; though it seems like you are thinking they wrote it in order to give the government power to 'keep the people safe and comfortable'.
     
  17. einride

    einride your best friend

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    to be fair, these groups find ways to get guns even in countries where it's basically impossible to get guns (sweden*)



    * unless you're gonna be huntin' moose
     
  18. KILL TULLY

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    True dat man.

    I enjoy input from all over about the subject but some Euro-dudes need to really put stuff into perspective; there are GAJILLIONS of guns in America that are not going anywhere, ever.
     
  19. einride

    einride your best friend

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    i don't actually see a useful distinction

    for instance, the fourth amendment about "the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures" was clearly written to ensure the people are secure from government tyranny

    if the government writes a document that aims to protect the people from itself, the goal being to create a country where people can live in safety and comfort (among other things), then that is giving the government power to keep the people safe and comfortable since the constitution is enforced by the government, no?


    just because something IS and probably WILL BE for the foreseeable future doesn't mean you can't think it's wrong

    i mean that remark in a very general way

    with that kind of thinking -- "don't even try, cause shit's never gonna change" -- not much good would ever come of the world
     
  20. KILL TULLY

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    I suppose it can be looked at that way; but it is more of a fence preventing them from having to much power in my opinion. It was very unique in that aspect at the time (and still to this day).
     

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