This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.

Welcome to Our Community

Wanting to join the rest of our members? Feel free to sign up today.

What part of a band are...

Discussion in 'General Metal Discussion' started by Alongside Death, Jun 4, 2008.

  1. Alongside Death

    Alongside Death On The Descent To Hell

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2005
    Messages:
    2,018
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    38
    ...fans. :)

    I would like to know what is your opinion about fans that support their favourite bands. There is no doubt that some bands create their albums to partialy satisfy their fans. What I mean is that some bands limit themselves because of them, they don't follow their artistic vein, they record things that fans would like to hear.

    Example: Some band exists for 15 years. The band have always been playing death metal, but their new album will be a little bit different because of the new concept of music that the band would like to place on their new album.

    Ofcourse opinions among the fans about the new album would be different, some would be open minded and they would except this new concept of a music whether it would be lighter or not. Others would stick onto the old style of the band and they would say "fuck this diarrhoea mess of an album" and they would probably hate the band until next their next album would fully satisfy them.

    And in my opinion it is bullshit because bands limit themselves because of those fans that would bash them for the new style of their music (ofcourse I mean only metal). We can only guess if a band that recorded a new album really followed their artistic vein, that they were not thinking in majority about fans opinion.

    Personally I am an open minded fan of my favourite bands, and I except any changes being made by them, just as I did with Mayhems "Grand Declaration of War" album.:p

    My questions are:

    1. Do you consider yourself as an open minded fan or a fan that stick to style of the music that a band have been playing for majority of its existence?

    2. What bands (in your opinion) are fully following their artistic vein and are still having many fans?

    3. Do you find it easy for a band to stick to one style of metal for it's whole existence, or do you find changes necessary to "check" the mentality of their fans.

    Thanks in advance! :kickass:
     
  2. Onder

    Onder Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2006
    Messages:
    11,393
    Likes Received:
    2,036
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Cryptopsy..? :erk:
     
  3. dimensional_entity

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    32
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    I personally feel that a band (a whole entity) should exist with a concrete goal in what they want to achieve. That goal shouldn't really change, or else they will alienate the people who have followed them to begin with.

    for instance in my own band, there is a specific style and objective I want, and I will keep that style. If I feel like doing something new, it will be under a different name, a different entity altogether. It is, to me, about retaining the spirit that formed the band in the first place.
     
  4. Einherjar86

    Einherjar86 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    18,431
    Likes Received:
    1,895
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Ivory Tower
    I love when bands change and try new things. Granted, it doesn't always work. But if they're one of my favorite bands, a bad album (or not as good as the previous) doesn't mean that I cease buying their records. I think Bathory is a prime example of a band that slowly altered and adapted its sound but still maintained its fan base. Then again, Quorthon was a genius.
     
  5. Zephyrus

    Zephyrus Tyrants and Slaves

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    25,502
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Maine or Iowa
    I consider myself an open-minded fan, especially in terms of when bands branch out toward other styles. For example, I'm all about the cross-pollination of Black Metal with several different styles such as industrial or progressive.

    I respect a band's musical direction, even when they reach a point where I don't enjoy their music as much. Samael, for example, began as Black Metal and slowly added more and more industrial and electronic elements, culminating in Eternal, which is one of my favorite albums ever. However, after that album the band's direction caused it to have lost enough of the Black Metal element that I enjoy it less. But this doesn't mean I disapprove of their new style. Samael's history is seen as a steady evolution, with no moments of compromise in order to appeal to fans.

    Ideally, a band that evolves like Samael knows that as a band evolves across styles, it will naturally lose older fans and gain new ones, and that there will be fans who enjoy all stages of their evolution. So long as they maintain that attitude, a band won't feel pressure to either preserve or alter their style for the purpose of maintaining or gaining fans.
     
  6. Einherjar86

    Einherjar86 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    18,431
    Likes Received:
    1,895
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Ivory Tower
    Yeah, Samael's a good example. Eternal is such a sweet record.
     
  7. Vegard Pompey

    Vegard Pompey ALLY TO GOOD, NIGHTMARE TO YOU

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2008
    Messages:
    4,685
    Likes Received:
    3,379
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Duwang
    1. I'm an open minded fan, to the extreme. If it really is a good band, they probably won't fail even if they change their style, as long as they don't sell out. They're good musicians that know what they're doing. Of the bands I like, I like almost every album to some extent.

    2. Dream Theater... I must be insane, but I think each of their albums has a vastly different sound. And yeah, Samael would be a good example.

    3. At least a few changes are vital. I don't like putting on Rhapsody's latest effort and hearing only variations of songs I've heard before.
     
  8. waif

    waif Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    18,908
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Montreal
    More like Amon Amarth...

    I think that the band should not take the fans into consideration at all when creating studio albums. Live taking fans requests into account when choosing setlists and stuff like that is great, but a studio album is a piece of art and as VVVVV said recently if art was designed to meet the viewer's expectations it would defeat the purpose. Something like that. Anyhow, my view of selling out is compromising what you want to do for what other people want you to do, and that applies to fans too.
     
  9. V.V.V.V.V.

    V.V.V.V.V. Houses Ov Mercury

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2004
    Messages:
    32,122
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Dracut, MA
    I think bands should always first go with their intuition and artistry when creating a new album and never care what fans will think. If they alienate fans, maybe they would be better off changing the name I suppose, but such things aren't of much concern when the bigger concern lies in the change from a preset goal to a new one, as mentioned previously in the thread.
     
  10. dimensional_entity

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    32
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    I think it has more to do with respecting your fans than anything. You can always create whatever you want, but I think it should be a seperate thing. For instance, what if Immolation made a disco album, and released it under their name? It would be completely dumb, I think. It would also be very different if they removed it from Immolation so that it has nothing to do with the band apart from being made by the same people.

    Ultimately I think it comes down to this. You have the choice of respecting your fans by remaining consistent to your original ideals while simultaneously following your creative instinct by releasing different material under a different entity. It's a win/win situation.
     
  11. SouthernTrendkill

    SouthernTrendkill Super Normie

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2007
    Messages:
    1,110
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    36
    I think it's a loop, actually. If an artist is respected for following their artistic heart, then what pleases the fans will be doing that, and if they decide to not do that, then the fans will be pissed.

    1. Do you consider yourself as an open minded fan or a fan that stick to style of the music that a band have been playing for majority of its existence? -- they're anything but mutually exclusive. Sometimes I'm supportive of a change, like Darkthrone, Neil Young, and sometimes I'm not, like Metallica, Cryptopsy.

    2. What bands (in your opinion) are fully following their artistic vein and are still having many fans? -- uhh... The Who, Pete said he wrote the latest album to impresse Rog (or was it the other way around?) instead of the fans. Bob Dylan because he goes back on the people who are trying to force him to represent integrity. As far as metal bands go... I think it's pretty hard for a metal band to not have integrity. It's metal, unless they're in the top 1% of bands, they don't have a mainstream sway. Actually to be honest I only wrote that top part for fun, I don't think it's possible to know if an artist is being "true" or not, or whether they should or shouldn't do so.

    The way I see it.. if they're making music you like, how do you know you're not just a part of these "fans" who supposedly only want the same old same old? So the only way to notice bands that are being "true" is when they've changed to a widely unpopular style (with the fans).

    3. Do you find it easy for a band to stick to one style of metal for it's whole existence, or do you find changes necessary to "check" the mentality of their fans.
     
  12. dimensional_entity

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    32
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Not necessarily true. Fans aren't always pleased by an artist's decisions just because that's what they want. For instance take Pestilence. They shifted to a more jazzy style of death metal removed from Malleus Maleficarum, and there are many fans of their original material that do not like that. They feel it tarnishes the legacy of Pestilence.

    I'm open minded in the sense that I won't usually dismiss things without trying them out. That doesn't mean I am obliged to like everything though.

    And yeah I think it is easy for a metal band to stick to one style even through a long career. Of course this doesn't mean that every album must be the same, but it doesn't mean that one album should be traditional heavy metal and the next should be brutal death metal.
     
  13. V.V.V.V.V.

    V.V.V.V.V. Houses Ov Mercury

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2004
    Messages:
    32,122
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Dracut, MA
    Second part of your post nails my feelings on slight evolution per album as a semi-necessity for most bands.
     
  14. rms

    rms Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2006
    Messages:
    14,019
    Likes Received:
    1,227
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Buffalo, New York
    im pretty sure Primordial is one of these bands or at least their front man.
     
  15. waif

    waif Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2007
    Messages:
    18,908
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Montreal
    For 2, pretty much any band that's on a big label has to have plenty of fans. Hence, any band on a big label that's following their artistic vein; In Flames, for example. Or Metallica. Megadeth.
    Death would be another. Morbid Angel too, probably.

    But what if a band liked playing a certain style and wanted to stick to it? Say Amon Amarth - almost no evolution up till WOoOS, yet I get the sense that that's because they really love playing that stuff.
     
  16. Addo_Of_Nex

    Addo_Of_Nex Fuck of Death

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,863
    Likes Received:
    25
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Peoria, Illinois
    I'm really not opposed to a band sticking to a slight formula, as long as it is well executed. As others have said, however, a change in sound over albums doesn't have to be a complete 180 degree change from what the band previously played.

    I can't speak on the matter of Amon Amarth, but a band like Darkthrone that released a string of albums in the same musical style could be used as examples here. Under A Funeral Moon and Transylvanian Hunger are without doubt the same type of music, but a transformation can still be seen between these two albums. As said above, the musical shift is not outside of the realm of raw black metal, but an evolution in sound is still very clear.

    The same situation is found in the case of countless other bands. To be honest, I prefer bands that stick to a solid path as opposed to bands who try to see how many genres of music they can play.
     
  17. cookiecutter

    cookiecutter Proceed to Ultraslamming

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2006
    Messages:
    16,312
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Toronto ON
    I think it depends on the band. Some bands are better because they change like Nachtmystium and some are better for staying the same like Bolt Thrower. Bands should listen to their fans and if they do change, change towards something equally or more musically interesting than what they were before.
     
  18. V.V.V.V.V.

    V.V.V.V.V. Houses Ov Mercury

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2004
    Messages:
    32,122
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Dracut, MA
    There are a few problems with your post, that I can see. First of all "bands being for the better" is of course subjective so making judgments on what bands particularly are better off progressing wildly or not at all are not really the best way to do this. Also, lots of bands who have been around long enough to have a following have two kinds of followings; rabid old-school fans and fans of their new stuff (if they've changed in some way at all in any case), so just saying "fans should influence them" is difficult because sometimes both camps are quite opposite in terms of what they want to hear from a band.
     
  19. cookiecutter

    cookiecutter Proceed to Ultraslamming

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2006
    Messages:
    16,312
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Location:
    Toronto ON
    Well obviously there will be disagreement, but I think it's easier to make the case that Nachtmystium has changed drastically but into a better band while Cryptopsy for example have not.
     
  20. Zephyrus

    Zephyrus Tyrants and Slaves

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    Messages:
    25,502
    Likes Received:
    40
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Maine or Iowa
    Three categories. You forgot fans of all the band's material.
     

Share This Page