Beauvais fiasco epilogue.

[the-lull]

As you probably noticed, a statement was made on the official website to bring the light on the progress of the Beauvais festival.
I truly hope that this promoter won't be involved in other organizations in the future. Having read a number of reactions on french forums, I can tell you his name is now well-known and that he was often described as being a mythomaniac with nothing but the ambition to show off as being the responsible to "the biggest show in the North of France":Smug:.
I understand the position of the members and respect it. Maybe it would have been a good thing that they expose their choice to the audience who was present on the day of the show, even though I suppose the anger prevented them to do so. I think that the frustration would have been then targeted to the guy exclusively.

Last thing; I truly hope that Katatonia will make it one day in the North of France. A lot of people there were actually asking for Katatonia between the bands performance. As I had suggested in the deleted thread: two places worthy of interest in the north of France, both in Lille: "Le Splendid" and "l'Aeronef". (and no, I'm not living here....)

 

[opethmaniac]

"I understand the position of the members and respect it"
I don't, sorry..Basically, they just say in the statement that they haven't played 1) for money/business stuff and 2) coz they didn't want to actually "promote" the promoter..Fine, but what about the other bands who played then ? Plus the promoter was already well known in the North of France for being that crap so having played wouldn't really have changed his reputation, only 250 persons being there (where the venue could have welcomed 4400 persons!). I just think it's a shame when business, in music or more even in rock/metal, is the rule bands follow..aren't they supposed to play rock'n'roll and to fuck the business rules when situations like this happen, which is basically the same thing than saying "we play for fans, not to get ourselves rich"..
I don't understand and respect them for what they did actually...but I DO understand and DO respect the bands who played on that festival a lot more than before all that shit happened...

 

[Cerulean]

Drop it already

 

[Vincent J.]

"I understand the position of the members and respect it"
I don't, sorry..Basically, they just say in the statement that they haven't played 1) for money/business stuff and 2) coz they didn't want to actually "promote" the promoter..Fine, but what about the other bands who played then ? Plus the promoter was already well known in the North of France for being that crap so having played wouldn't really have changed his reputation, only 250 persons being there (where the venue could have welcomed 4400 persons!). I just think it's a shame when business, in music or more even in rock/metal, is the rule bands follow..aren't they supposed to play rock'n'roll and to fuck the business rules when situations like this happen, which is basically the same thing than saying "we play for fans, not to get ourselves rich"..
I don't understand and respect them for what they did actually...but I DO understand and DO respect the bands who played on that festival a lot more than before all that shit happened...

sorry, but this is bullshit.
The other bands that did play have their own reasons... This is about why Katatonia didn't.
And can't you understand that it would be fucked-up for the band to be screwed like that?? I mean, by not playing they say "fuck you!" to the promoter. If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
It's all about the message.

only 250 persons being there

what about the lots of people on the net reading about this?

aren't they supposed to play rock'n'roll and to fuck the business rules when situations like this happen, which is basically the same thing than saying "we play for fans, not to get ourselves rich"..

They need to live you know... It's not like they are doing this music-thing for éxtra money, it's their job... that means they dó need the money.

 

[Vincent J.]

Drop it already

indeed

 

[Juniper]

Why should he drop it?
Sorry I don't understand that...
This is a forum right? To give ur opinion about things and not to brownnose and only say wonderfull things about the band...Im not saying that u are brownnosing its just that it irritates me to see that when people give their not so positive opinion its like its not alowed...
Why should you try to silence people who are saying negative things about Katatonia? I think they are strong and mature enough to handle it themselves...

Im not judging them for not playing because I wasnt there and I dont feel that I can really put myself in their position...
I can understand the dissapointment of the fans coming out there and their appreciation for Anathema and the other bands that did play.
And I also think that the people jumping to conclusions before knowing Katatonia's side of the story were in the wrong but I thought it was a bit overreacting to delete the whole thread...
It felt a bit like censorship...

 

[Vincent J.]

And I also think that the people jumping to conclusions before knowing Katatonia's side of the story were in the wrong but I thought it was a bit overreacting to delete the whole thread...
It felt a bit like censurship...

well, the thread it all started with was only closed, not deleted.
It was closed because there was only (quite pointless and repeating) speculation going on, without knowing the real reasons yet.

the second one was deleted because it was pretty much exactly the same stuff as the first one

 

[Juniper]

Okay closing ,deleting same thing.... there are more threads where a lot of stuff is being repeated and where speculations are being made.. this one was about something negative for katatonia so it wasnt alowed...
I understand that jesse is trying to keep this forum nice and stuff but I don't feel that it was nescesary to react the like that..

 

[Cerulean]

Why should you try to silence people who are saying negative things about Katatonia?

That's not at all what I'm trying, I'm just having trouble with 2 things here:

Some of these people talk about the band in quite an offensive manner, and I don't like that. Not just for Katatonia, but any band.
I fully support the expression of opinions, but if someone can't do it in a civilized, respectful way, I don't appreciate it.
I don't care at all if he doesn't agree with what Katatonia have done here, it's his right to do so. There's just no need to go in any kind of offense.

Second, he has told us the same thing more than once by now, hence this new reaction is unnecessary. I'm sure we all understood what he meant the first time.
To me, it seems like people who repeat things are just craving for a reaction from the people they're targeting. In this case, the band itself. I'm pretty sure they read it the first time, and apparantly didn't feel the need to directly reply, which is their right. Instead they made an announcement on the official site, but still this didn't change some people's statements it seems.


My 2 cents on all this: I support Katatonia in their decision for one single reason: if they had played, the promoter would've won this 'battle', and he would realise all too well that he actually got away with it. This means that he'd use these dirty tricks in many years to come, because it would work anyway.
Katatonia did the right thing by boycotting the promoter's festival this way.
Of course it's very sad for the fans, and I'm sure everyone feels sorry for them, but it's exactly the fans that should be the FIRST ones to understand Katatonia's decision and support them.

 

[the mourner13]

There were already insults in the first one...was that not enough to close it and delete the second one to stop it before any possible insult???This maybe the place to discuss our ideas but not the place to insult Katatonia without knowing any shit about what happened...Besides it's already explained in the official site so there's no more to discuss IMO...

 

[Vincent J.]

Okay closing ,deleting same thing.... there are more threads where a lot of stuff is being repeated and where speculations are being made.. this one was about something negative for katatonia so it wasnt alowed...
I understand that jesse is trying to keep this forum nice and stuff but I don't feel that it was nescesary to react the like that..

okay, but I fully agree with jesse to close/delete the threads.
Because people were very much insulting the band like madmen, without they knew about what was going on. Only rumours.
Closing threads like that also prevents some people from embarrising themselves a lot with some overreacted posts...
And those people put Katatonia in a bad daylight without any rational reason whatsoever, which I (and I guess pretty much all of us) despise.

 

[jptk]

Okay closing ,deleting same thing.... there are more threads where a lot of stuff is being repeated and where speculations are being made.. this one was about something negative for katatonia so it wasnt alowed...
I understand that jesse is trying to keep this forum nice and stuff but I don't feel that it was nescesary to react the like that..

When people started insulting the band and calling them "wankers", is when the thread was closed and rightfully so.

 

[the-lull]

I mean, by not playing they say "fuck you!" to the promoter. If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
It's all about the message.

No exit between these two opposite points of view:
1/If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
2/If they díd play for the fans, they would have show loyalty to their fans...

They need to live you know... It's not like they are doing this music-thing for éxtra money, it's their job... that means they dó need the money.

We don't share the same vision of the word "music"...
And I'm quite sure Katatonia guys have a job. Or at least they had one when Last Fair deal gone down was out.

Now as I 've said, I personnaly understand and respect the band decision, but mainly because Anathema has done the show, so that my money was not totally lost. If all the bands have decided to boycott the festival, yes, the promoter would have treated as h deserved, but what about us, people with a real passion for music ?

 

[Juniper]

When people started insulting the band and calling them "wankers", is when the thread was closed and rightfully so.

I agree that insulting the bandmembers like that is way out of line... but still there were other people expressing their opinion in that thread also and jesse already posted that insulting and personal attacks like that werent alowed... so again : I dont see the point of closing the whole thread ...
thats My two cents ands Ill just leave it at that

 

[Vincent J.]

No exit between these two opposite points of view:
1/If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
2/If they díd play for the fans, they would have show loyalty to their fans...

Appearently the first one did weigh heavier than the second...
IMO not a bad thing in this case.

We don't share the same vision of the word "music"...
And I'm quite sure Katatonia guys have a job. Or at least they had one when Last Fair deal gone down was out.

I know, but what I meant is that they are probably not in this thing for getting rich. the thing I didn't like about opethmaniac's way of putting...

 

[the-lull]

I know, but what I meant is that they are probably not in this thing for getting rich.

Now we share the same vision of music business

 

[Vincent J.]

Oh and btw,
I don't like where this "discussion" is going.
I mean, we're all saying the same thing over and over and over.
I'm really sure we now all know exactly what's going on.
Well, either you like the choices Katatonia made or not... it's up to you to decide.
But dón't argue about it!

 

[Vincent J.]

Now we share the same vision of music business

 

[opethmaniac]

I know, but what I meant is that they are probably not in this thing for getting rich. the thing I didn't like about opethmaniac's way of putting...

Yep, sorry, I haven't used the right words..let's say "getting some cash" instead..

And yeah,
"No exit between these two opposite points of view:
1/If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
2/If they díd play for the fans, they would have show loyalty to their fans..."
That's exactly that...Then, it only depends on the band's point of view..

 

[Vincent J.]

Yep, sorry, I haven't used the right words..let's say "getting some cash" instead..

And yeah,
"No exit between these two opposite points of view:
1/If they díd play for the fans, they would accept being screwed...
2/If they díd play for the fans, they would have show loyalty to their fans..."
That's exactly that...Then, it only depends on the band's point of view..

haha, I already thought you meant that after re-reading everything...
sorry for the misunderstanding..!