I think I remember making a sidetrip there when I was up there for PP1. I remember picking up a copy of POS's Perfect Element 1 SE (with the Japanese bonus tracks), which I got signed by the band at ProgPower. I also picked up a cheap copy of the Bulletboys first album.
Metal Haven closes in Chicago!
- Thread starter Savage Pumpkin
- Start date
modernwizardry
I want stout!
There's a shop called Music Masters in Downer's Grove. He specializes in progressive and classic rock but he can get you any CD you're looking for. Visit that one before it closes...
KYF_Cincinnati
The Metal Professor
I agree with Jasonic on this, it's like the article says... in 1999 Napster lowered the price point from $14 for a CD to free. Even in 2003, after iTunes got people buying music tracks for just 99 cents, it wasn't as attractive as free.
So how was the industry going to get people to buy again??? Not by keeping the price point the same...
So where are we at now? According to online download tracker BigChampagne Media Measurement, the volume of unauthorized downloads continues to represent about 90% of the market.
-KYF
It's a tough situation... Because competing with FREE is not really fair... I am not sure that charging 15.99 or 12.99 will make much of a difference if you are going against $ 0.00...
And it's hard to lower your prices when your sales are going down drastically... You still have all your operational costs + the cost of production... You still have to pay all your bills, cover the same cost with less units being sold... It's not easy...
And staying on topic: I too grew up buying CDs on indie CD shops in Rio de Janeiro.. Most of them closed down recently... The one that was right next to my house is still open, I pay them a visit everytime I go to Rio...
nomisofsiman
Member
The Rolling Stone Issue that either came out the end of last year or the beginning of this year did a decade in review. I found it very interesting that the year (or maybe the year after) the ipod came out was the best selling year in music. Since that time, it has decreased at a rapid rate.
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
here is how you change the model of how to compete with "free"
1) walk up to the closest mirror you have.
2) look yourself in the eye
3) if you steal music online...call yourself a THIEF and/or a CRIMINAL and walk away ashamed and realize YOU are part of the f*cking problem.
you can blame the industry all you want, but guess what? they actually OWN the product you wish to consume. not you, if you did then you would be in a band called KAMELOT, HAMMERFALL, etc but you aren't you are on this board like me.
the bottom line is "free" is not "free" just because it's out there for free, downloading it doesn't make it right. it's called having a conscience. people can sit on this board and justify downloading anyway they want (sure i do it because i am impatient person, but i also have a 9,000+ cd collection. so i am obviously not the problem) but it doesn't change the fact that if you didn't pay for it then it is stealing.
i managed an independent record store here in town for over 10 years and watched it die, and now people come up to me saying they are bummed it's gone because they cannot find any music they like and they miss the atmosphere. sure chatting on this board is cool, but i know very few on here personally, but i knew hundreds of people that shopped at the store. it was actual people of like minds not avatars and signatures.
there is something wrong with the digital age. one day we will wake up and understand, or at least i can hope.
i applaud the people who continue to support music physically and somewhat applaud those who buy music digitally - not my thing, so i cannot support 100%
but until we can reverse the acceptance of THIEVING, things will never change and just how stores are closing here, bands will soon cease to be able to make the music we love.
agree or disagree, this is a subject in which my mind can never be changed so don't bother.
1) walk up to the closest mirror you have.
2) look yourself in the eye
3) if you steal music online...call yourself a THIEF and/or a CRIMINAL and walk away ashamed and realize YOU are part of the f*cking problem.
you can blame the industry all you want, but guess what? they actually OWN the product you wish to consume. not you, if you did then you would be in a band called KAMELOT, HAMMERFALL, etc but you aren't you are on this board like me.
the bottom line is "free" is not "free" just because it's out there for free, downloading it doesn't make it right. it's called having a conscience. people can sit on this board and justify downloading anyway they want (sure i do it because i am impatient person, but i also have a 9,000+ cd collection. so i am obviously not the problem) but it doesn't change the fact that if you didn't pay for it then it is stealing.
i managed an independent record store here in town for over 10 years and watched it die, and now people come up to me saying they are bummed it's gone because they cannot find any music they like and they miss the atmosphere. sure chatting on this board is cool, but i know very few on here personally, but i knew hundreds of people that shopped at the store. it was actual people of like minds not avatars and signatures.
there is something wrong with the digital age. one day we will wake up and understand, or at least i can hope.
i applaud the people who continue to support music physically and somewhat applaud those who buy music digitally - not my thing, so i cannot support 100%
but until we can reverse the acceptance of THIEVING, things will never change and just how stores are closing here, bands will soon cease to be able to make the music we love.
agree or disagree, this is a subject in which my mind can never be changed so don't bother.
nomisofsiman
Member
here is how you change the model of how to compete with "free"
1) walk up to the closest mirror you have.
2) look yourself in the eye
3) if you steal music online...call yourself a THIEF and/or a CRIMINAL and walk away ashamed and realize YOU are part of the f*cking problem.
you can blame the industry all you want, but guess what? they actually OWN the product you wish to consume. not you, if you did then you would be in a band called KAMELOT, HAMMERFALL, etc but you aren't you are on this board like me.
the bottom line is "free" is not "free" just because it's out there for free, downloading it doesn't make it right. it's called having a conscience. people can sit on this board and justify downloading anyway they want (sure i do it because i am impatient person, but i also have a 9,000+ cd collection. so i am obviously not the problem) but it doesn't change the fact that if you didn't pay for it then it is stealing.
i managed an independent record store here in town for over 10 years and watched it die, and now people come up to me saying they are bummed it's gone because they cannot find any music they like and they miss the atmosphere. sure chatting on this board is cool, but i know very few on here personally, but i knew hundreds of people that shopped at the store. it was actual people of like minds not avatars and signatures.
there is something wrong with the digital age. one day we will wake up and understand, or at least i can hope.
i applaud the people who continue to support music physically and somewhat applaud those who buy music digitally - not my thing, so i cannot support 100%
but until we can reverse the acceptance of THIEVING, things will never change and just how stores are closing here, bands will soon cease to be able to make the music we love.
agree or disagree, this is a subject in which my mind can never be changed so don't bother.
I fully endorse this post. A lot of people tend to want one thing, but will not own up to the fact that they are part of the problem. Though I would say (and I could be wrong) that metal fans in general tend to want cds more than any other type of genre. For example, with how much those vendors make off of us at Progpower. Do you think at any other type of festival, people would be as interested in buying cds?
The digital age is screwing things up on a monetary level in addition to a social one as well. Buying music used to be an experience. Now it's just "click" and delivered. On a social level, in addition to not having that communication process in a store with people that are actually interested in music, people are instant messaging or texting instead of calling or in person interaction.
The problem is I see this as a point of no return. I wish things could go back the way they were, but everything has become way too easy nowadays. People want things as easy as possible, as cheap as possible and as fast as possible.
Well, that's my rant for the evening. haha.
Pellaz
Tigron of Immanion
* boggle *
Shit, and I thought Tennessee had high sales taxes!
That graph looks a lot starker -- by design, surely -- than reality.
The base of that graph represents $6 billion in sales...so while it looks as if sales have trended down from some big number down to almost zero, in actuality sales have decreased by about half.
It's still a HUGE decrease, considering that the number of people who could be buying music is steadily increasing, but the graph is designed to make it look, at first glance, like the entire CD industry will be vanishing in a couple of months.
Me, I give it at least two years, and perhaps as long as five.
Jasonic
Doom On!
Cross this with the Grammy thread.
The digital age killed the LP / CD format.
The fans of mainstream artists never care about the FULL album, they want the single.
Now with ITUNES and what not, pop fans can download just the song they want.
I think the CD format can still prosper for underground music where the demand should still remain, though certainly on the decline.
I will admit that once I got an IPOD, my thoughts on the matter changed.
Now whenever I purchase a CD, it pretty much gets ripped to ITUNES, then to my IPOD, with the CD going to the cabinet never to be looked at again.
Love them or hate them, I really dig what Billy Corgan is doing with the current SMASHING PUMPKINS release.
He is releasing one song at a time for free on the band's website.
I think this is smart, since for the next how many months or years, fans will continuously go to the site.
This will keep the band's name fresh in fans minds.
Also, thousands will repeatedly be exposed to other news, tour dates, items for sale, etc.
This might be easier for a guy like Corgan, who has his own studio, and the means to do all of this with little cost except his own time to do this.
Think though too about My Space.
I am at work at a PC for 8 + hours a day.
Many times when I want to listen to a band, I just go to their My Space, and listen to their tracks.
Some bands have about 8 songs up there, so I certainly get my "fix" for that artist.
Sure, some times it results in my buying that band's CDs, but other times not.
The digital age killed the LP / CD format.
The fans of mainstream artists never care about the FULL album, they want the single.
Now with ITUNES and what not, pop fans can download just the song they want.
I think the CD format can still prosper for underground music where the demand should still remain, though certainly on the decline.
I will admit that once I got an IPOD, my thoughts on the matter changed.
Now whenever I purchase a CD, it pretty much gets ripped to ITUNES, then to my IPOD, with the CD going to the cabinet never to be looked at again.
Love them or hate them, I really dig what Billy Corgan is doing with the current SMASHING PUMPKINS release.
He is releasing one song at a time for free on the band's website.
I think this is smart, since for the next how many months or years, fans will continuously go to the site.
This will keep the band's name fresh in fans minds.
Also, thousands will repeatedly be exposed to other news, tour dates, items for sale, etc.
This might be easier for a guy like Corgan, who has his own studio, and the means to do all of this with little cost except his own time to do this.
Think though too about My Space.
I am at work at a PC for 8 + hours a day.
Many times when I want to listen to a band, I just go to their My Space, and listen to their tracks.
Some bands have about 8 songs up there, so I certainly get my "fix" for that artist.
Sure, some times it results in my buying that band's CDs, but other times not.
nomisofsiman
Member
You're absolutely correct. People who like pop, like singles. Notice that once downloading became available, singles were no longer in stores. This is why.
I still buy all cds believe it or not, despite mostly utilizing an ipod. However, that's mostly for use when I'm traveling or driving. If I want music to be played at home, I still do actually use the cd. I've never been someone that does shuffle.
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
i do agree with this fact. metal fans are pretty good, but those are the cult fans. call yourselves whatever you want but people who attend PP and buy cds from vendors there are cult metal fans regardless of genres. go to ozzfest and ask the masses there if they still buy music and see what you get.
but i have also found that if more bands take the approach and be VOCAL about their dissatisfaction and disappointment in their fans downloading their music rather than buying a shirt or whatever they will listen. if i had a nickel for every time a fan said they would just download our album (and i don't mean from itunes), but bought a shirt i would be a rich man. i always thank them for the sale, but inform them i would much rather them buy our music than a shirt because i don't create shirts i create music.
my band, thanks to my doing, released two cds at the same time a few years ago. 1 album was readily available in stores and on itunes. the 2nd album was only pressed on CD and is only available at live shows and via OUR estore (and a few select vendors, instructed not to sell to stores just to online customers) and is not available digitally.
and with most upcoming Tribunal releases i am adding bonus tracks to the CDs and not digital releases. the digital release will be inferior. fans may not like it, but i am offering something special to the people of like minds and who have the want to keep tangible art alive and well.
at our live shows i speak out to fans attending about downloading and how it hurts. i am VERY outspoken about this subject and fans have started to listen i think. it at least causes discussion at the merch table and i try and educate fans on the subject from a band/label perspective.
even if no other bands will take a stand, it's how i feel and i will always do so because it needs to be done.
if you get bored you can watch my nightly tour rant about the subject a fan caught of me live a few years ago in Orlando (i was pretty drunk hence the pausing, beers being handed to me, etc).
but it's the same speech every show.
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Ear Wax
http://www.earwaxwisconsin.com/Ear_Wax_Record_Shops.html
The Milwaukee shop closed a year or two ago.
The Exclusive Company is where I do most of my shopping. They special order titles with ease. Good customer service and good prices. The store is on State Street, right around the corner from Ear Wax.
johan68
Member
here is how you change the model of how to compete with "free"
1) walk up to the closest mirror you have.
2) look yourself in the eye
3) if you steal music online...call yourself a THIEF and/or a CRIMINAL and walk away ashamed and realize YOU are part of the f*cking problem.
you can blame the industry all you want, but guess what? they actually OWN the product you wish to consume. not you, if you did then you would be in a band called KAMELOT, HAMMERFALL, etc but you aren't you are on this board like me.
the bottom line is "free" is not "free" just because it's out there for free, downloading it doesn't make it right. it's called having a conscience. people can sit on this board and justify downloading anyway they want (sure i do it because i am impatient person, but i also have a 9,000+ cd collection. so i am obviously not the problem) but it doesn't change the fact that if you didn't pay for it then it is stealing.
i managed an independent record store here in town for over 10 years and watched it die, and now people come up to me saying they are bummed it's gone because they cannot find any music they like and they miss the atmosphere. sure chatting on this board is cool, but i know very few on here personally, but i knew hundreds of people that shopped at the store. it was actual people of like minds not avatars and signatures.
there is something wrong with the digital age. one day we will wake up and understand, or at least i can hope.
i applaud the people who continue to support music physically and somewhat applaud those who buy music digitally - not my thing, so i cannot support 100%
but until we can reverse the acceptance of THIEVING, things will never change and just how stores are closing here, bands will soon cease to be able to make the music we love.
agree or disagree, this is a subject in which my mind can never be changed so don't bother.
Extremely well said. Agree 100 % with all of it.
Now I'll listen to my Dimage cd I bought from Den @ Sentinel Steel.
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
Extremely well said. Agree 100 % with all of it.
Now I'll listen to my Dimage cd I bought from Den @ Sentinel Steel.
hahaha, awesome. thanks for picking it up. hope you dig it! not sure why Nikki LOF never presented it to me before he did. it's one of my favorites i have ever released! so catchy.
LINE OF FIRE has re-recorded some tracks for their new album. it has taken so long to complete due to illnesses and various things that they never intended to have DIMAGE out before it, but it just happened that way. the new versions are great too! shawn has definitely a different vocal range than Scott does.
Diabolik
Member
I am glad that everyone is in agreement about the social aspect of CD buying. With going to Metal Haven for so long almost every weekend I have met some great people who I now call freinds. Lots of people I would never have thought I would be freinds with in a million years due to age or just never have met them. Most of my time in the store was talking to people and stuff. I have also ben able to turn people on to many bands that they would never even try.
From talking to Mark he has even said people would come into the store and look around and pretty much say that anything that was a new release they already downloaded.
I am a browser / impulse buyer. I would say about half o fmy collection of CD's...at least over 1,000 now has been from impulse buying. I have an amazing eye for picking gems out of crap. Plus having heard stuff being played also has gotten me to buy some great stuff ( like Metal Law ).
It is a shame that the store is closing. I literally spent hours there on saturdays. It wasnt just a place I would go and buy new cd's and leave. While I also buy CD's online...it just isnt the same. The socal aspect isnt there and I like to walk in and get stuff...not wait weeks to get the wrong stuff even. We can all try to point fingers at different reasons why this happens...but it isnt just music shops....book stores and such are also feeling it. We are now in that digital age. I have seen it with my career. I used to work in a room where 8 people did the work now since everything has gone digital we are down to 3.
Now I need to find a place where I can rant all my crazy beliefs and idea's once the store is gone. dang.
From talking to Mark he has even said people would come into the store and look around and pretty much say that anything that was a new release they already downloaded.
I am a browser / impulse buyer. I would say about half o fmy collection of CD's...at least over 1,000 now has been from impulse buying. I have an amazing eye for picking gems out of crap. Plus having heard stuff being played also has gotten me to buy some great stuff ( like Metal Law ).
It is a shame that the store is closing. I literally spent hours there on saturdays. It wasnt just a place I would go and buy new cd's and leave. While I also buy CD's online...it just isnt the same. The socal aspect isnt there and I like to walk in and get stuff...not wait weeks to get the wrong stuff even. We can all try to point fingers at different reasons why this happens...but it isnt just music shops....book stores and such are also feeling it. We are now in that digital age. I have seen it with my career. I used to work in a room where 8 people did the work now since everything has gone digital we are down to 3.
Now I need to find a place where I can rant all my crazy beliefs and idea's once the store is gone. dang.
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
he is a THIEF. so when you buy stuff from him be sure that you tell him Matt from Tribunal/Divebomb Records said he would really like to be paid the $500+ he owes me and until i get paid i will be sure to remind everyone what kind of douchebag he really is. did i mention he is a THIEF yet?!
i have heard through the grapevine i am not the only record label he has done this too, either which is the worst part.
sadly enough he can get my stuff from one-stops so i have no way of preventing him from carrying my new releases. so when you see my SARGANT FURY and stuff on his site know he didn't get them from me.
OrbWeaver
BECAUSE FALCONER
There are plenty of street corners in Chicago proper that you can use for your rant platform.
he is a THIEF. so when you buy stuff from him be sure that you tell him Matt from Tribunal/Divebomb Records said he would really like to be paid the $500+ he owes me and until i get paid i will be sure to remind everyone what kind of douchebag he really is. did i mention he is a THIEF yet?!
i have heard through the grapevine i am not the only record label he has done this too, either which is the worst part.
sadly enough he can get my stuff from one-stops so i have no way of preventing him from carrying my new releases. so when you see my SARGANT FURY and stuff on his site know he didn't get them from me.
Thats a pretty childish way to project your opinion. I have hard feelings on two online vendors myself which I could post pages of anger filled diatribe. My point is that if you have a problem with this vendor that's fine, make up your own thread about it. Be forewarned, make sure you have documented proof of what you say. I know of a couple of people that were charged with slander with no evidence of the contrary. Just my two cents.
