What do you guys think of capitalism and of the money-oriented way of life of the majority in the most developped countries?
Opinions on capitalism
- Thread starter niniel
- Start date
And by the way, I don't want to turn this into some kind of internet war, after all, we're supposed to be evolved people...unless you guys think we're evolving backward in the wisdom domain. Just feel free to express your opinions on that, I think you guys are openminded enough to accept the diiferent opinions of everyone.
Everyone who have the posibility to take part of this discussion(through computers, and all that) are of course a victim for capitalism........ I don't like it though.
mr V
mr V
Devilot
Terrible One
I agree, I don't like it either. Unfortunately it would be nearly impossible to get away from it. Seems like money is a deciding factor in nearly everything.
rahvin
keeper of the flame
i like it and i don't feel like i'm a "victim" of my computer, unless it crashes suddenly.
my biggest problem with "getting away" from capitalism is not having the slightest idea as where to turn to instead. i guess one might try living hand-to-mouth and/or accepting some fundamentalism or other, but right now i still feel better enslaved to the heavy yoke of working for my money and then buying what i need to live.
rahvin.
my biggest problem with "getting away" from capitalism is not having the slightest idea as where to turn to instead. i guess one might try living hand-to-mouth and/or accepting some fundamentalism or other, but right now i still feel better enslaved to the heavy yoke of working for my money and then buying what i need to live.
rahvin.
Ziuwarian
Ancient
Unfortunately, there is no GETTING AWAY from capitalism, but I would father see it vanish than get away from it. It's an obsolete remnant of an idea from the 19th century (actually, trade and money are the real root of evil here in this matter, capitalism is just thinking along the way. Mankind is always good for keeping incomplete ideas instead of working on them so they become full, or just lives with inherited norms). The idea might have looked good at the time, but just like with communism, it didn't reckon the human factor too well. And I think we should have evolved beyond this system already, but some people won't allow this.
So what do you think is the way to get away from capitalism to a "better world"? A revolution? Politics? I don't see any realistic chances for any way, so far... but without trying we will never know, won't we?
So what do you think is the way to get away from capitalism to a "better world"? A revolution? Politics? I don't see any realistic chances for any way, so far... but without trying we will never know, won't we?
I'm looking forward to the day nanotechnology makes it possible to replicate infinite amounts of goods from any raw material (Star Trek style)
That will destroy all economy
Also I'd like to have my mind uploaded into a supercomputer someday so I can rule the world
That will destroy all economy
Also I'd like to have my mind uploaded into a supercomputer someday so I can rule the world
rahvin
keeper of the flame
@luguber: not everything that's imaginable is bound to happen, you know. having our minds uploaded somewhere sounds very likely, though.
rahvin.
rahvin.
Jim LotFP
The Keeper of Metal
What else would you do?
Ever read Atlas Shrugged?
I hate, hate, HATE the idea of socialism and communism because
A- they don't work perfectly any more than capitalism works perfectly, because ANY human system will have corruption at top levels
B- People get things that other people involuntarily paid for with their work.
I am a capitalist ass. I hate that taxes are taken out of my paycheck against my will, under threat of government force, to pay for art programs, welfare programs, etc etc.
I understand that some government involvement in income redistribution and regulation is necessary (schooling, because how else would poor children EVER make a better life for themselves, and environmental issues so a corporation doesn't dump toxic sludge in your backyard, that sort of thing), but for the most part that should be out out out out out out of people's everyday lives.
I believe everyone should be responsible for their own lives and if someone is forced to look after their neighbor's needs, that's an infringement on their freedom.
rahvin
keeper of the flame
@jim lotfp: yours is the statement i agree with the most on this thread.
i'm also perplexed about all this demonization of money as if it was the root of all evil. systems without conflicts over anything are utopia-like worlds, and i don't think i would even like living in one.
rahvin.
i'm also perplexed about all this demonization of money as if it was the root of all evil. systems without conflicts over anything are utopia-like worlds, and i don't think i would even like living in one.
rahvin.
Jim LotFP
The Keeper of Metal
... I don't think I'd call myself a 'victim' of capitalism concerning this computer I bought with money earned from my labor...
Fjelltussa
...
I don't think it's so bad. There are positive and negative matters about everything. And how long will it last, anyway!? How long will we last? Nothing lasts forever.......
I would have posted my own opinion on capitalism first, but I was a bit scared that such a virulent towards it might keep people who like this system from expressing themselves(at least, some...). And I'll spare you some details....especially about my somewhat psykotic solution.
I used to be in a group at college that, among other things, distributed a paper every months to sensibilize people to some of the horrors commited in the name of profit so that there might be more than a minority who cared.
Unfortunately, I was to confused at the time to write anything coherent so I only gave my opinions on what was to be published or not. The people who did write in that paper were anarchist/extremist and they scared away most people with the violent way they told things. The only people we touched were those already caring.
Worst than that, it turned to trying to convince people that anarchism was THE way. I have nothing against anarchism(their vision of it at least), but it is known that it won't work in such a huge society. And I don't pretend I have the answer either. I'm a weird kind of fascist/elitist though since I know of mankind's corruptible nature, I doubt that my ideal vision of how it should be would work.
I still hope that someday(far from today though) we'll evolve beyond that money/possession obsession that seems to be leading this world to its downfall. Not that I care so much about most of mankind, but I think certain people are evolved enough to be worth surviving, and I don't know them all. If I was a bit more insane than I am, I would personnally kill all the unworthy people on earth, but I don't think it's my right to play god, and since I don't believe there is a god, I won't waste time praying for this to happen. I'll rely on evolution, hoping mother nature is not playing a trick on us and doing it backwards...
I used to be in a group at college that, among other things, distributed a paper every months to sensibilize people to some of the horrors commited in the name of profit so that there might be more than a minority who cared.
Unfortunately, I was to confused at the time to write anything coherent so I only gave my opinions on what was to be published or not. The people who did write in that paper were anarchist/extremist and they scared away most people with the violent way they told things. The only people we touched were those already caring.
Worst than that, it turned to trying to convince people that anarchism was THE way. I have nothing against anarchism(their vision of it at least), but it is known that it won't work in such a huge society. And I don't pretend I have the answer either. I'm a weird kind of fascist/elitist though since I know of mankind's corruptible nature, I doubt that my ideal vision of how it should be would work.
I still hope that someday(far from today though) we'll evolve beyond that money/possession obsession that seems to be leading this world to its downfall. Not that I care so much about most of mankind, but I think certain people are evolved enough to be worth surviving, and I don't know them all. If I was a bit more insane than I am, I would personnally kill all the unworthy people on earth, but I don't think it's my right to play god, and since I don't believe there is a god, I won't waste time praying for this to happen. I'll rely on evolution, hoping mother nature is not playing a trick on us and doing it backwards...
Lutz
Member
Sadistik
Let me die in solitude...
Obviously, socialism and other mutual benefit forms of life are the ideal, but totally impossible, as the will of one is not the will of many, nor should it be...therefore I agree that capitalism is the best, though not totally ideal, option......
Allison
Member
Capitalism breeds so many negative things. If people could keep things under control and within reason and not become corrupt with it then it would be OK but since that is apparently impossible in countries like USA then I have to say that I am opposed to capitalism.
Well, You shouldn't take my statement about computers precise, I was of course using computer as a general term. If you have a computer you're of course a product of a society that have developed into what we call capitalism. But that's not good or bad is it? it's what you do within it, and trying to expand the frame into your own vision of what life is about.
I mean that I don't like the spiral that we"generally" are following in a global perspective, the kinda reversed Robin Hood style that are present. But on a more personal level I'm satisfied with what i have, what I've created, What I aim to do and express in what ever forum it relates to. My goals and acheivements are something that gives me warmth and light. But still I see life as a long learning process.
And the evolution of technology can and should of course help us to understand more about ourselves and the infinite. I was just comparing......and meaning that if we see technology as a mentor instead of a tool it can accelerate our bad judgement that seems to never be absent.
mr V
I mean that I don't like the spiral that we"generally" are following in a global perspective, the kinda reversed Robin Hood style that are present. But on a more personal level I'm satisfied with what i have, what I've created, What I aim to do and express in what ever forum it relates to. My goals and acheivements are something that gives me warmth and light. But still I see life as a long learning process.
And the evolution of technology can and should of course help us to understand more about ourselves and the infinite. I was just comparing......and meaning that if we see technology as a mentor instead of a tool it can accelerate our bad judgement that seems to never be absent.
mr V
rahvin
keeper of the flame
although i agree that there are many dangers inherent - as there are many dangers inherent to any other situation in life - as far as i know capitalism is the only society structure that made possible all the achievements and goals many ppl find are their reasons for living. at least so far.
that's why i almost never feel like blaming capitalism in itself for the plagues ailing society.
rahvin.
that's why i almost never feel like blaming capitalism in itself for the plagues ailing society.
rahvin.
*transforms everyone into anti-capitalists*
If only there were more people wanting to be involved in changing the way people think...
If only there were more people wanting to be involved in changing the way people think...
Silver Sable
The Silver Goddess
I must say that personally I think capitalism isn't the problem... Human nature is.
I enjoy the benefits of the system without being caught up in the drive to have more.
I do find it interesting that the current direction of most capitalist nations is a growing schism between the rich and poor. This of course will only contribute to a fall of the current capitalist system as the growing number of "poor" will create a new social upheaval. I just hope I'm long gone before that happens... or the system corrects itself and creates an acceptable balance.
I enjoy the benefits of the system without being caught up in the drive to have more.
I do find it interesting that the current direction of most capitalist nations is a growing schism between the rich and poor. This of course will only contribute to a fall of the current capitalist system as the growing number of "poor" will create a new social upheaval. I just hope I'm long gone before that happens... or the system corrects itself and creates an acceptable balance.
