Christcore is not Metal.

[Lycanthrope]

I never thought of lyrics as being a defining factor of metal. In fact, PD, you're the first person I've ever heard make this argument. I realize this is just you stating your opinion, which I have no problem with, but I don't think your particular rationale holds water as far as the great majority of metal fans and artists are concerned. The responses thusfar are testimonial of that. It is those artists and fans that collectively make up the genre. In other words, the people make the metal. I guess you could say that the term 'Metal' is an abstract. There are no hard and fast definitions, per se. One man's metal is another man's trash.

Ok, now for my opinion.
I completely disagree with your notion. I find it interesting that you didn't mention Satanism (another religion) as not being metal. Personally, I find Satanic lyrics pretty silly for the most part, but I still listen to Venom and Danzig, etc. They promote their personal beliefs just as a Christian band might do. I guess you wouldn't consider them metal either, eh? After all, if you say they ARE metal, that would be a double standard, which would then blow your theory full of holes and negate any credibility it may have had. Am I right?

hmmm... Now you've got me curious. :Smug:

 

[Thanatopsis123]

If I could find a Britney Spears song with lyrics that could be interpreted to fit your idea of "metal ideology" would that make it metal? Probably wouldn't be hard with rap either.

What about a band that sounded like Behemoth or something and had lyrics that expressed no specific ideology or lifestyle? Would they still be metal? What about a band like, say, Pan.Thy.Monium where there are no lyrics to be seen and they're hardly decipherable?

 

[J.]

That's right, Christcore, (like Hardcore) is not metal.

First of all, who said it was metal? Hell, the majority of people don't even consider hardcore as a metal genre, so why would Christcore (which I've never heard of) be any different?

Now people might say; "Well what if the individual chooses to be Chrsitian?" I'll say it right now, submitting one's self to some "higher power" is NOT individualism.

Yet, accepting the "metal lifestyle" is being individualistic? People need to understand that by being a non-conformist, you are merely accepting another group's ideology, hence you are not an individual by your standards.

The only way to truly be a non-conformist is to be yourself.

 

[no country for old wainds]

Yes. Because ideology is all the matters, not the music.

 

[Neurotic]

i think this is just a stupid topic, to me there's only bad lyrics or good lyrics, i don't like preaching in music but if the lyrics are done well fuck it.
i really like extol and morbid angel and both are so far away lyric wise.
i remember the 1st time i read extol lyrics i was wtf? cuz its not my point of view but they're just express their beliefs and opinions and the reasons why they worship god, so what?(isn't that what everybody does?expressing their opinions) i don't see nothing wrong with that, i think satanic lyrics are really gay too if they written badly just like christian lyrics are gay if they're written badly, i think the problem is that mosty metalheads are just close minded people.
i rather see good christian lyrics than the average dm i kill your baby raped your mother shit, those are the worst imo!
its all music people enjoy it, who cares if its metal or not.

currently listening to some extol and i think it is very metal!!!

 

[ProphesizedDoom]

If metal is all about individuality, how is a choice to not fit the metal confines... unmetal?

Metal is about individuality, the part of it you're not seeing though is that Christianity is NOT about individuality, but rather submission to some higher deity.

 

[SLAYER85]

quote:Fuck Geek Tunes. Fuck anything which is even remotely linked to Winamp. I now officially fucking hate Winamp. And if it suddenly became alive, and ran in front of a car, and got horribly mangled, I'd smirk.

Agreed winamp is the biggest piece of shit ever, when i installed it, it totally rearranged my comp settings and i had to go through in reset everything, very "pissyouoffawholegoddamnlot-ing"

 

[i acnt spell]

Now, I'm not taking either side here. I'm a Christian, but personally I can't stand hearing people babble on with Christian theology in their music. It's not why I listen to metal. Metal is fantastic art form that I choose to enjoy because I can use my imagination in the same way that I use it when reading medieval British literature. And for the record, I cannot stand most power metal, that is not what I'm getting at here. I am trying to say that I enjoy gorebands and bands like Cannibal Corpse because through fantasy I can become a murderer, even though I have no desire to murder another human. Also, I can enjoy Satanic bands because through their music I can become even a little more evil, without any real desire to become any more evil in the least.

Everything that you are referencing as reasons that "christcore" is not metal (which honestly, particularly with hardcore, I pretty much agree with), refer to the past efforts in the metal genre, but that's not a particularly good way to make an argument. Metal is a form of music, and thus an art form. By definition, art forms evolve, change, and progress. Your claims about what metal "was" shows no acceptance to the fact that metal is progressive and evolving, and therefore, in essence, disregard metal as a form of art (music) at all, making your argument pretty weak.

 

[SLAYER85]

When i think hardcore, i think unbridled hate for the way they pit. what the fuck is that windmill shit, im seeing hatebreed this sunday and i think im gonna get into a fight with some of these windmilling-hardcore-imjustheretofuckpeopleup monkeys

 

[killthisday]

You guys realize you all sound like a bunch of hardcore kids right?

 

[Harp Heaven]

Personally, I think your post is silly, PD. You are attributing way too much importance to a constant of your own (or anus.com`s) devising, which is that metal music somehow is deeply rooted in philosophy and that there are certain virtues that makes you "more metal". Intellectualizing metal is fallacious, as the genre wasn`t defined by people with six-pences and Nietsche-books, rather by regular guys meaning to create music they found interesting. As I see it, In 99% of cases, a certain philosophys` importance to a band has been added by other people, and the recent proliferation of this is owed to the new breed of metal-philosophers, e.g. the reviewers at anus.com. The bottom line of what I`m trying to say is that metal can only be defined by the social-anthropologic approach: metal is what the majority consider to be metal. Geez, I guess this means that the individual should be left to form his/her own opinion of what metal is. Isn`t that a shame?

 

[tal shiar agent 930]

agreed, that church has no business creating the same music that they have tried to destroy for many years. besides, everyone knows why they create such bands.

 

[Hatebreeder33]

i agree with harp heaven.

 

[blakmetalemp]

Makes absolutely no difference what the hell anyone is preaching. Just cause someone doesnt like "xtian" lyrics, or satanic lyrics for that matter, doesnt make it non-metal. Thats the stupidest cop out ever told. If a rap group makes a xtian album do you not still call it rap???? Yes you do. No difference with metal. (except for metal is better )

 

[Neurotic]

i think this topic is just stupid, music is a way of expression, i'm not christian(actually i was babtized dammit) i consider myself an atheist but i see no wrong with this bands, sometimes they can get cheesy but so does power metal,death metal,blackmetal....like i said before i prefer to read a good christian lyric exposing their ways in a inteligent way than any stupid gore(except carcass), power metal, satanist lyric etc...of course i see no wrong in an inteligent satanist,pm lyric also...and wtf who cares if its metal, all i know is that extol is great fucking band, and i think its very metal, they rock

....music is an art,just enjoy it...

 

[Sonicarnal Artist]

I will not respond to a specific person, as I've already waded through a plethora of bullshit without leaving the first page, so instead, I'll make a concise and brief point.

Art is classified primarily by its medium, in this case, music. Music as a medium can be further subdivided into various genres, such as classical, metal, et cetera.

Traditionally, the definitions and parameters of each said genre can be defined by many different aspects of the overall piece of music/art, such as the overall sound, and of course, the inspiration for its conception.

When it comes to internal reactions and evocations of mood that are conjured by exposure to the piece, there are really three primary classifications in relation to the creation of music:

A) Music that tells a definite story.
B) Music meant to convey a mood (abstract)
C) Music for music's sake.

What is commonly referred to as metal is classified largely into the first two areas (B more often than not), and therefore, is greatly influenced by the motivation for its conception which is hinted at and conveyed through the lyrics. Outside of more abstract and absurdist pieces, this is generally, the law.

As it has been mentioned, the subclassification of 'metal' is identified for its strong messages of personal revolution and identity (which is often displayed through highly violent messages), which is completely antithetical to moral and Zionist subversion.

In summary, to say that metallic music with Christian messages is still metal is like saying that Gospel choir music with Satanic messages is still gospel music.

 

[Sonicarnal Artist]

Oh, and in case it should come up, I consider myself a Eclectic Luciferian with a mosaic of influences ranging from Transcendentalism to Nihilism.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Thank you so much, SA, for suffering through our 'plethora of bullshit' to enlighten us all with your gratuitous onslaught of polysyllabic dynamics.

What an insulting and pretentious post.

 

[blakmetalemp]

In summary, to say that metallic music with Christian messages is still metal is like saying that Gospel choir music with Satanic messages is still gospel music.

Metal is a genre people. Not some kinda idea.

 

[Neurotic]

this is why i don't even consider myself a metalhead, metalheads are too damn closed minded, ok its not metal, i still kicka ass music ....
this stupid thread makes me think some people here are affraid to listen to something that isn't metal....fuck its all music, and by the way what is the definition used for those bands...(christian music with an heavy sound?)
i guess metal has to be always about hate....people complain about philosopher lyrics, christian lyrics, .....what would be next? metal has to be about satan or gore? fuck that shit!!!! give my intelligent, meaningful lyrics!