A Sound of Thunder made it to CNN

[Diabolik]

Good attempt at twisting that.
A truly strong woman who would strive for credit on her musical merit doesn't have to say "I'm a woman in music", as if she is asking for extra consideration for a handicap or something.
Wonder if Marie Curie was underlining the fact that she was a woman. Note; I mention her because I believe she might actually be an "inspiration" to women.
So what is it going to be, a level playing field or a girls club, a boys club?

And this is what I was talking about with bands like Axxion. I see OrionSon can't figure this out. Bands like this don't use having a girl in the band as a crutch or something needed to extra attention. They are just a member of the band. They are not front and center in band pictures or used to sell the band. They are held on merit alone. This to me give them much more credibility than bands that have a girl in the band and have to sell it as ...."female fronted". Music is music if it is a man or a woman singing. Does it have more merit if there is a different gender singing? I see it as a crutch for bands who have to use that term in selling their music.

 

[J. Golden]

Actually, there's nothing wrong with a man living with 2 women if they're both kosher with it. It's called Polyamory, and it's becoming more mainstream/acceptable as time goes on. Also nothing wrong with a bit of bondage, if that's what you're into.

Female metal singer weighing in here (no pun intended) - knowing more of the background (ie knowing the ex was abusive, etc etc), it does suck that the article was twisted and piecemealed.
I don't however, find any issue with the band being mentioned. For one thing, it goes to show you can go from a frumpy fat girl, so uncomfortable in her own skin she considered herself thankful for having an abusive ass as a boyfriend because he at least wanted her (Sorry Nina!!) to being a confident, fit/healthy woman, who not only realizes her own worth but inspires those around her (ie young women in metal) as the frontwoman of a successful metal band (and if you'd like to argue if ASOT is successful or not,I point you to their last Kickstarter).

That being said, IMO people (men AND women mind you) fear that which is "different". They fear this strong, independent woman in front of them, and it's far easier to find something to tear you down about than to say "Well, hell, good on you. I haven't achieved the success you have, but I'm pleased for you and wish you the best."

So, I'll say it...
You guys in ASOT have busted your arses to achieve a hell of a lot more than a lot of local metal bands have been able to (I can't wait to rebuilt mine post move and get started again), and I'm proud of you for it. Good on you. And good on you for the weight loss and keeping it off, Nina.

"Actually" there is no need for correction. I never said these things were wrong, I merely stated that Willy was a misogynist, and tacked on the other points because it was just fitting. Interesting that woman carries the image of a role model of a strong woman who was created by such and man who liked to suppress women.

 

[Diabolik]

Agree to disagree I guess. To me, it is cheap because if bare tits are involved, people will listen to or go see a band even if they make bad music. I think Butcher Babies proves this phenomenon. At least with Huntress there is some musical substance there, but in my mind tweeting out naked selfies of yourself on the toilet does reflect poorly on a band and affects the way I perceive their music.

see and this is the same thing as having a member of a band posting stuff on forums and making obnoxious comments on social media. It has the same effect. In the end for some it will effect how people perceive their music. People love to crack on larger acts who have a member that is in the media making stupid comments because it is easy to jump on that bandwagon....but if the band isn't a large act it seems wrong for people to do that.

 

[OrionSon]

And this is what I was talking about with bands like Axxion. I see OrionSon can't figure this out. Bands like this don't use having a girl in the band as a crutch or something needed to extra attention. They are just a member of the band. They are not front and center in band pictures or used to sell the band. They are held on merit alone. This to me give them much more credibility than bands that have a girl in the band and have to sell it as ...."female fronted". Music is music if it is a man or a woman singing. Does it have more merit if there is a different gender singing? I see it as a crutch for bands who have to use that term in selling their music.

I see what you're saying. The line just seems so arbitrary, which is where my confusion comes from. Male singers are front and center in band photos. So how come when a female singer is front and center it's bad? It's like a "don't ask, don't tell" situation. You're allowed to be a woman in metal, just don't let anyone know or you're selling the band with sex. The double standard just annoys me and probably explains why there aren't as many female metal singers.

 

[Justin G]

Agree to disagree I guess. To me, it is cheap because if bare tits are involved, people will listen to or go see a band even if they make bad music. I think Butcher Babies proves this phenomenon. At least with Huntress there is some musical substance there, but in my mind tweeting out naked selfies of yourself on the toilet does reflect poorly on a band and affects the way I perceive their music.

Maybe I'd feel the same if I didn't like the Huntress albums or Jill didn't know her metal as much as she does. I see her posts and write it off as marketing, which any band has to do to survive. Or maybe she just likes expressing herself that way. More power to her.

 

[freakchylde]

Another female weighing - not from the metal standpoint, as my music career was extremely short and my athletic career was more important...

As others have said, the article was poorly written. Most of the ASoT references (for those who didn't pay attention in Lit 100 and 101) came from the author's voice. Nina was pretty much "Hey, my hobby is singing and I tour with a band, so I need the energy." Really, if the author is a paid journalist, I need to re-write that interview and go down to CNN and tell them they owe me my job back.

From the female standpoint....any female who is in a position that is traditionally filled by a man is very cognizant of the fact that they are female. The only reason most relegate the "hey, I'm a chick in this role." is because it brings attention to it and the drama that comes with it (for example: this thread). As an athlete from way back when women's teams didn't exist, I had no choice, I had to be one of the guys. That brought its own issue, and I'm glad that girls these days have options to avoid those issues.

It always comes down to, "Oh shit, you have tits!" Almost makes me want to respond, "Oh shit, that's what you call a penis?"

My $.02.

Nina, keep it up, you're awesome and good luck with the band.

 

[Diabolik]

I see what you're saying. The line just seems so arbitrary, which is where my confusion comes from. Male singers are front and center in band photos. So how come when a female singer is front and center it's bad? It's like a "don't ask, don't tell" situation. You're allowed to be a woman in metal, just don't let anyone know or you're selling the band with sex. The double standard just annoys me and probably explains why there aren't as many female metal singers.

Nothing worse than seeing band photos of say the singer...male or female and then the rest of the band pushed far into the background. Or like I was refering too with bands that sell themselves as lets say..."female fronted power metal". To me it makes the rest of the band look like backing musicians and not even a band...almost like you are the backing band for someones ego. The bands I was talking about have female members and don't even push the fact that they do because they are going on music quality to push their band other than that they have a girl in the band.

 

[DuchessOfDork]

The double standard just annoys me and probably explains why there aren't as many female metal singers.

 

[Justin G]

Nothing worse than seeing band photos of say the singer...male or female and then the rest of the band pushed far into the background. Or like I was refering too with bands that sell themselves as lets say..."female fronted power metal". To me it makes the rest of the band look like backing musicians and not even a band...almost like you are the backing band for someones ego. The bands I was talking about have female members and don't even push the fact that they do because they are going on music quality to push their band other than that they have a girl in the band.

I disagree with Bob on the vocalist out front thing, but I grew up in the '80s, so that's what I expect. That's why they're called frontmen. Or women.

I do agree with the whole "female fronted" tag. It's like you're saying the singer's gender is the defining characteristic of the band.

 

[DuchessOfDork]

I do agree with the whole "female fronted" tag. It's like you're saying the singer's gender is the defining characteristic of the band.

Just a quick explanation on this:

People classify their bands as "female fronted" because often, a woman's voice is different from a man's voice. This gives people an idea of what to expect and helps with marketing. If I had a voice like a dude, we probably wouldn't do this. However, some people are into lady voices so it helps to let people know, hey, I sound like a lady.

Just my quick explanation.

 

[Diabolik]

Just a quick explanation on this:

People classify their bands as "female fronted" because often, a woman's voice is different from a man's voice. This gives people an idea of what to expect and helps with marketing. If I had a voice like a dude, we probably wouldn't do this. However, some people are into lady voices so it helps to let people know, hey, I sound like a lady.

Just my quick explanation.

understood...this was what everyone thinks and knows....it though also is a good way to turn away people from said band because there are people who don't like female vocals and won't even give them a chance because they are being sold as "female fronted". Or just get lumped into the Nightwish / Epica clones. While I hate when people say they don't like bands because there is a female singer...it instantly puts up a wall for some to even try to hear your band then because they won't even try it because of that. While it is there to help and I am sure it does...there is also a downside to that.

 

[J. Golden]

see and this is the same thing as having a member of a band posting stuff on forums and making obnoxious comments on social media. It has the same effect. In the end for some it will effect how people perceive their music. People love to crack on larger acts who have a member that is in the media making stupid comments because it is easy to jump on that bandwagon....but if the band isn't a large act it seems wrong for people to do that.

To bad this lady is dead, GammaJosh could have discussion with her about how tits cheapen...

 

[Justin G]

understood...this was what everyone thinks and knows....it though also is a good way to turn away people from said band because there are people who don't like female vocals and won't even give them a chance because they are being sold as "female fronted". Or just get lumped into the Nightwish / Epica clones. While I hate when people say they don't like bands because there is a female singer...it instantly puts up a wall for some to even try to hear your band then because they won't even try it because of that. While it is there to help and I am sure it does...there is also a downside to that.

Yep. Right or wrong, when that's the main descriptor I'm much less likely to give the band a chance. To me it's code for "our music isn't strong enough without pushing the gender aspect".

 

[DuchessOfDork]

Basically, it's damned if you do and damned if you don't. Either way, people will complain, so I'd rather focus on the positive than the negative.. and the positive has been great! When he's not arguing on his phone, Josh is recording guitars for album #5!

 

[Mardoch]

Just a quick explanation on this:

People classify their bands as "female fronted" because often, a woman's voice is different from a man's voice. This gives people an idea of what to expect and helps with marketing. If I had a voice like a dude, we probably wouldn't do this. However, some people are into lady voices so it helps to let people know, hey, I sound like a lady.

Just my quick explanation.

The most entertaining part of this tag with regard to this discussion is that you don't sound like the females in most female-fronted bands. You sound like a female who's singing, not a female singer. More like Ida Haukland than Simone Simons.

 

[DuchessOfDork]

The most entertaining part of this tag with regard to this discussion is that you don't sound like the females in most female-fronted bands. You sound like a female who's singing, not a female singer. More like Ida Haukland than Simone Simons.

Thank you! That's where the style part comes. We call ourselves "A traditional heavy metal female fronted band" so I imagine that explains what we sound like.

 

[J. Golden]

However, I feel slightly bad about using any negative female example here, because a couple people here clearly have major issues with women in general, and I'm probably only fueling their misogyny.

How the fuck is it negative?
I'm sure I'm one of those people you are referring to with the misogyny comment. Well I ask you this; do you assume that this women are not doing want they want, and should they not only not be alone to but respected for it? You come off as if you might think that they are unwillingly objectified. I would think that assumption alone might be a bit disrespectful to women.
I think it would have been interesting to hear Wendy O's thoughts on that too.
But for the record I have no issue with misogyny per say, I'm more than willing to pimp the image of women,


just as I believe women like the Butcher ladies have the right to do it themselves. I see true empowerment in what they do and I'm sure they don't give a shit what any pussy bitch guys think.

 

[J. Golden]

I disagree with Bob on the vocalist out front thing, but I grew up in the '80s, so that's what I expect. That's why they're called frontmen. Or women.

I do agree with the whole "female fronted" tag. It's like you're saying the singer's gender is the defining characteristic of the band.

Damnit man, now you have a crush on Nina too.

Yep. Right or wrong, when that's the main descriptor I'm much less likely to give the band a chance. To me it's code for "our music isn't strong enough without pushing the gender aspect".

Guessing you disrespect women too?

 

[nailz]

I just want to know where Nina and Glenn find these gifs.

Reddit. Though the sheer amount of Drag queens she's got at the read is mind blowing.

 

[OrionSon]

Another small thought: a band might get attention for a hot singer, but how many of them stay and become fans? If I can't stand the music, I won't listen no matter what the singer's bra size. Or ass, I don't discriminate. So how accurate is the claim that some bands only get fans from marketing their singer? A legitimate question, I'm sure some guys will tolerate bad music for a good looking singer.

P.S: I love A Sound of Thunder's music, so that comment about hating music wasn't for y'all guys!