Diabolik
Member
you forgot....they are longtime buddies. He got drunk with them once. So it is all cool.
Some cool tunes from 2010
- Thread starter Fire breath
- Start date
you forgot....they are longtime buddies. He got drunk with them once. So it is all cool.
Diabolik
Member
I honestly think that nothing can replace the way it feels to shop in a store for music. Majority of the bands I listen to where stuff I came across looking for other bands in a store. I remember years back that you could go all over the city to different stores to get stuff. You could literally spend all day record / cd shopping. Sure it is easier to order online or download. But nothing beats walking into a store. Talking to others who are there and discussing bands and stuff. It is also a great way to find out about shows and other happenings. That era is pretty much gone. It is a shame that there will be new generations who will never be able to experience it.
Dolamite S. Biffle
Biffliest Person Ever
you forgot....they are longtime buddies. He got drunk with them once. So it is all cool.
Actually I walked in and tried to paid, but Chris and John E. told me not to. I did hang out with them afterwards and smoke a lot of "medicine" with them so hopefully that compensated or the shots I bought them.
Yeah I live in Lawrence (35 miles west) so I dont know how well it was promoted, but I dont really work with Live Evil as much as I do with Hunt Industries.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
you forgot....they are longtime buddies. He got drunk with them once. So it is all cool.
Yep.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
Well that did not help out the other bands on the bill looking for a cut off the door. Honestly your money should have went to the bands if not to Widow there was at least two others. Buying shots for Widow did nothing for the other bands, so no it doesn't help.
It is really messed up that so many people out there are willing and up for hanging with the band to be cool or whatever but when it comes to supporting them those people leave the party when the weed is smoked up and the beer runs dry. I see this crap with so called "fans" and piss ant "promoters" and no one ever points it out or calls it what it is. At least the groupies give blows in the back of the van.
I'm not suggesting all of them are this way, some people have decency so I hear, but several are and they know it...Well I retract that, most convince themselves otherwise just like the downloading people. There is always something that "compensated".
So to sum up if $4.00 shots can be aforded for the band then there is enough money to rightly pay at the door or buy a damn CD.
Diabolik
Member
I agree with you 100% percent. With certain bands I really like I will always buy something from them at the show. I have seen Cauldron live twice and bought shirts both times because I want to support bands I like. For both there shows the door price was really low so I knew they were not getting a decent amount of money so I knew anything helps. I used to videotape almost every show I would go to back in the 90's and bands would be like...."come on in for free". I would always pay. I never take anything for free. I want to support what I like. I always feel band for the locals since you know everyone is calling them that day of the show asking to get on the guest list. It is a sad state when people say that they support the scene and help bands but in reality it is something they do just to be seen and so they can name drop. Who really is impressed with anyone who talks about bands they met or hung out with. I am not a teen girl going crazy over meeing bands. Hats off to the people who are buying CD's, going to the shows and buying merchandise at the show. this is what fuels the scene....not stealing and using bands for your own sake.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
Amen brother.
LOL Read these forums much? Seems that is all that goes on here sometimes.
I was talking with a buddy of mine who tours with big shows and Buddy Guy doing merch. He was telling me about all these guys he has run into over the years like Queensyche, KISS, big mainstream artist bla bla, and we both agreed that it comes to a point when it doesn't seem like such a big deal when these people's numbers are in your cell phone. Not suggesting that I have Gene's digits but you get the point.
So many of these metal bands I'm one call away from or easily can contact them so it removes the glitz. And there is that point when I grew up too.
There was a thread in this forum about something like "how do you talk to the band". My girlfriend pointed it out to me and she had several priceless jokes at the time. It came down to the question are these guys serious?
I don't get it myself. But being a fanboy is one thing we all are to some degree, but a band parasite is a whole different issue entirely.
TwizstedJesus
Member
- Mar 1, 2004
- 1,219
- 24
- 38
My take on illegal downloads...
Since starting a collection in the early 80's, I've accumulated 2400 cassettes, 8700 cd's and 150-200 albums. If I could have heard these before I purchased, the numbers would be probably half on cassettes/Cd's and about the same on albums. When the whole DL'ing thing firmly took hold, I was telling everybody..."If you take from the artist without paying for it, you are stealing. If you like the product that they are putting out, you must buy the CD or the artist makes no money and future releases become rare, if at all. I realize that it has become so easy to just download instead of going out and buying, and the entire music industry is a joke these days. They could have saved their business, but instead they tried to play hardball and continue to force feed us CDs at bloated prices instead of lowering prices to keep people interested in buying their product, all the while knowing that downloading could seriously damage their business. So in that aspect, every time I download something I say to myself, FUCK THE LABELS! But in the same breath, when I hear a song or a disc that blows me away, it becomes a must have and I DO purchase said CD.
I was late to the party. I bought my 1st Mp3 player in November...too bad it was a Zune which has been sent back twice in 8 months (Microsoft piece of shit). I bought an iPod to replace the Zune a few months back, but I still feel guilty downloading things even if I plan to buy them. But this is the way of the world...we can't change it, so we either get on board or get left behind. I agree with Zod...There should be nothing wrong with test driving a car if your intention is to find the best car for you and purchase it. The question of is it stealing or is it not is probably not a valid question anymore...the world has changed, and even though it has affected people negatively (cd store owners, musicians etc...) it is what it is.
My biggest concern...say you find a download from a band that blows you away. Not many people have heard it nor will they, due to whatever circumstance. 3 years from now your iPod dies, 6 months after your harddrive fried...and you do not have this bands cd backed up anywhere. Now you cannot find a download to replace this...what then? People say that anything is available on the internet, but if you ever spent time looking for something rare, you know how untrue that statement is...Where do you find this download again?
Just a question without a good answer...
Since starting a collection in the early 80's, I've accumulated 2400 cassettes, 8700 cd's and 150-200 albums. If I could have heard these before I purchased, the numbers would be probably half on cassettes/Cd's and about the same on albums. When the whole DL'ing thing firmly took hold, I was telling everybody..."If you take from the artist without paying for it, you are stealing. If you like the product that they are putting out, you must buy the CD or the artist makes no money and future releases become rare, if at all. I realize that it has become so easy to just download instead of going out and buying, and the entire music industry is a joke these days. They could have saved their business, but instead they tried to play hardball and continue to force feed us CDs at bloated prices instead of lowering prices to keep people interested in buying their product, all the while knowing that downloading could seriously damage their business. So in that aspect, every time I download something I say to myself, FUCK THE LABELS! But in the same breath, when I hear a song or a disc that blows me away, it becomes a must have and I DO purchase said CD.
I was late to the party. I bought my 1st Mp3 player in November...too bad it was a Zune which has been sent back twice in 8 months (Microsoft piece of shit). I bought an iPod to replace the Zune a few months back, but I still feel guilty downloading things even if I plan to buy them. But this is the way of the world...we can't change it, so we either get on board or get left behind. I agree with Zod...There should be nothing wrong with test driving a car if your intention is to find the best car for you and purchase it. The question of is it stealing or is it not is probably not a valid question anymore...the world has changed, and even though it has affected people negatively (cd store owners, musicians etc...) it is what it is.
My biggest concern...say you find a download from a band that blows you away. Not many people have heard it nor will they, due to whatever circumstance. 3 years from now your iPod dies, 6 months after your harddrive fried...and you do not have this bands cd backed up anywhere. Now you cannot find a download to replace this...what then? People say that anything is available on the internet, but if you ever spent time looking for something rare, you know how untrue that statement is...Where do you find this download again?
Just a question without a good answer...
nomisofsiman
Member
This is another main reason why I like to have the physical property apposed to downloads. If your computer/hard drive crashes, you're fucked. Seeming as though that has happened with some of my computers over the years, I would never do that.
BenMech
student of the d'eh
Orion Crystal Ice
Rider of the Astral Fire
Tribunal wins thread.
IMO.
(I have to say IMO for the politico-correcto-ness of it.)
You know..
I've been playing and writing a good 10 years..and the craft continues to be sharpened....Always wanted to make a record, a full blown record.... Tons of material....and my band indeed has the capability to blow the lil' ones and some of the big ones off the stage..
What's this? Oh it's the Internet..awesome! Now millions of people will be able to hear my hard work. Wait, not so fast. I don't click on bands' stupid spam links with their cold-call style of communication... that probably means that me even having a logo up decreases my band's chance of being heard, since everyone else is sick of the thousands and thousands of bands online too.
Well, what should I do? Can't just sit around and wait to be noticed on mp3.com or myspace..
LET'S MAKE A DEMO! $&*& YEAH!
Ok, so I'm the only one in the band not in college - and thus - have a job which produces $$$$...the means of creating a demo!
I'm gonna tell everyone! This is going to be awesome!
"You know nobody buys CD's anymore, right?"
"You shouldn't even bother, nobody gets signed anymore."
"Why not just make an album yourself? It's not that hard."
But I only have x amount of cash. It's either do one and see what happens or sit around getting older. People will understand it's made on a budget, after all, I'm learning from example, hundreds of reviews and testimonies absolutely everywhere you look...that's how you do it..make a demo, maybe two..learn things along the way....someone, big or small, sees some potential... you learn you some marketing ropes....put the debut out, work your butts off to promote it, pay stuff back....tons of bands have done it, life is good.
"You know that ALL THE LABELS JUST RIP YOU OFF RIGHT??"
Wait, aren't I supposed to be the guy that knows something since I'm actually INVOLVED IN THE BUSINESS? What are you talking about? Not ALL do. Good grief. Turn off the VH1.
"You won't make any money."
Who said I wanted to? I want to make a record. If I wanted to make money, my sentence would be as follows: I want to make money.
But.........................................wait..
The internet is supposed to give people freedom to listen to what they want, a change from what the media shoves at them.
But it seems like when the fans have a choice..
...most of them still choose the hip and cool thing..
.............which concludes in those doing the trendy stuff being most of the bands which are signed..
............................and even they are losing sales because people just aren't buying anything.....
.....................................and people aren't buying anything because people either don't have jobs, don't have good jobs, and MOST OF ALL, think that their simple mindset of entitlement should throw off how the ENTIRE SYSTEM works.
..
Aghast!
Guh. Well, now what? I already put the stupid thing out. We have good reviews, a decent little following here and there. But I'm still totally broke. Because I have a job and I pay rent and I wasn't shoved into college by my rich parents, or even had parents that gave a crap what I did.
Even though we're an example of one of the little people within a huge sea of bedroom and internet bands who actually want to get up off our butts and do something.
I guess me and my merry little troupe of musicians simply deserve to languish in obscurity, doing next to nothing, and getting old. Serves me right for not magically coming up with $10,000 and then giving all the albums away for free. Silly me for bothering with trying to create any kind of art these days, ho ho ho! Remember, it's all about what the masses want, and they just don't have enough numbers if YOU DON'T JOIN UP WITH THEM. Let's get with the program. We shouldn't run the show, people with next to no knowledge about the business or how it works should. Why? Well.........um, I mean, because that's just how it is. What do you mean you need a stable reason?
Eh, better get out of here quick before somebody on the Internet thinks I'm complaining and decides to call me out on it!
IMO.
(I have to say IMO for the politico-correcto-ness of it.
)You know..
I've been playing and writing a good 10 years..and the craft continues to be sharpened....Always wanted to make a record, a full blown record.... Tons of material....and my band indeed has the capability to blow the lil' ones and some of the big ones off the stage..
What's this? Oh it's the Internet..awesome! Now millions of people will be able to hear my hard work. Wait, not so fast. I don't click on bands' stupid spam links with their cold-call style of communication... that probably means that me even having a logo up decreases my band's chance of being heard, since everyone else is sick of the thousands and thousands of bands online too.
Well, what should I do? Can't just sit around and wait to be noticed on mp3.com or myspace..
LET'S MAKE A DEMO! $&*& YEAH!
Ok, so I'm the only one in the band not in college - and thus - have a job which produces $$$$...the means of creating a demo!
I'm gonna tell everyone! This is going to be awesome!
"You know nobody buys CD's anymore, right?"
"You shouldn't even bother, nobody gets signed anymore."
"Why not just make an album yourself? It's not that hard."
But I only have x amount of cash. It's either do one and see what happens or sit around getting older. People will understand it's made on a budget, after all, I'm learning from example, hundreds of reviews and testimonies absolutely everywhere you look...that's how you do it..make a demo, maybe two..learn things along the way....someone, big or small, sees some potential... you learn you some marketing ropes....put the debut out, work your butts off to promote it, pay stuff back....tons of bands have done it, life is good.
"You know that ALL THE LABELS JUST RIP YOU OFF RIGHT??"
Wait, aren't I supposed to be the guy that knows something since I'm actually INVOLVED IN THE BUSINESS? What are you talking about? Not ALL do. Good grief. Turn off the VH1.
"You won't make any money."
Who said I wanted to? I want to make a record. If I wanted to make money, my sentence would be as follows: I want to make money.
But.........................................wait..
The internet is supposed to give people freedom to listen to what they want, a change from what the media shoves at them.
But it seems like when the fans have a choice..
...most of them still choose the hip and cool thing..
.............which concludes in those doing the trendy stuff being most of the bands which are signed..
............................and even they are losing sales because people just aren't buying anything.....
.....................................and people aren't buying anything because people either don't have jobs, don't have good jobs, and MOST OF ALL, think that their simple mindset of entitlement should throw off how the ENTIRE SYSTEM works.
..
Aghast!
Guh. Well, now what? I already put the stupid thing out. We have good reviews, a decent little following here and there. But I'm still totally broke. Because I have a job and I pay rent and I wasn't shoved into college by my rich parents, or even had parents that gave a crap what I did.
Even though we're an example of one of the little people within a huge sea of bedroom and internet bands who actually want to get up off our butts and do something.
I guess me and my merry little troupe of musicians simply deserve to languish in obscurity, doing next to nothing, and getting old. Serves me right for not magically coming up with $10,000 and then giving all the albums away for free. Silly me for bothering with trying to create any kind of art these days, ho ho ho! Remember, it's all about what the masses want, and they just don't have enough numbers if YOU DON'T JOIN UP WITH THEM. Let's get with the program. We shouldn't run the show, people with next to no knowledge about the business or how it works should. Why? Well.........um, I mean, because that's just how it is. What do you mean you need a stable reason?
Eh, better get out of here quick before somebody on the Internet thinks I'm complaining and decides to call me out on it!
skyrefuge
Member
This seems backwards to me. I would say that it's much easier to get fucked with CDs than mp3s. If your home has a fire or is burglarized (and as this thread shows, those are not just theoretical possibilities), how do you recover that rare recording in that case? Whereas, if you're using a non-physical storage medium, when a hard drive dies or gets destoyed/stolen, you just go to your backup and immediately restore it.
What's that? You don't have a backup of your music? Well, then that's a failing of the *user*, not a failing of the storage medium. Since both CDs and electronically stored mp3s can be lost/damaged/destroyed, a backup of your collection is highly-recommended regardless of what medium you prefer. The difference is that it's FAR easier to make a duplicate of an electronically-stored mp3 collection than a CD collection. You can do a one-step copy of your entire collection onto a device the size of a paperback book, and store it at a different site than your main hard drive. Safe, fast, and easy. I keep my "backup" drive at my office, with the bonus that I then have my entire collection always available to listen to at my office as well as my home.
Electronic storage and delivery of music may have its downsides vs. CD, but recovery is definitely *not* a downside!
Neil
Try www.mozy.com - Less than $5 per month and all my hard drives are fully backed up. All my music, all my pictures. Even 100Gb or so of HD video of my kids. There is no excuse not to have everything backed up anymore.
So you understand the argument of most of the pro-downloaders here - we have to be sure before we buy. You've done it yourself. Sure, some people say they will buy the CD if they like it but really don't; statistically I'm sure there are a LOT more in that category than there are who actually buy the CD, especially when you figure in the <20 crowd that really doesn't have the money yet but has tons of peer pressure.
Lumping everyone that downloads into the same category and calling them all thieves, regardless of whether or not they purchase the music, is a terrible solution. I wish I could think of a better system because the honor system isn't working, but I still haven't come up with one. My conscience is clean.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
To be honest I was going to buy the CD anyway, saying "I had to be sure" was really not the case at all. I buy many albums on a whim taking a chance, usually power metal believe it or not and they often suck a**. Well you take your chances I guess.
As for peer pressure" that is a bulls@#T excuse like the concept of A.D.D. If one wants the album then save your lunch money simple as that. Exactly what I did in grade school.
J. Golden
Heaven and Hell Records
Might be missing something here but illegally downloading and backing up ones CD collections are not the same thing. I have been working since Dec. to rip all my CDs to a hard drive (a major task it turns out, but all of those are my CDs.
If the argument comes up that I bought the CD but it burned up or was stolen whatever so I should be able to go and download it well that is wrong too. If your car is totaled it doesn't entitle one to go to the lot and get a new car.
Music is not a socialist commodity. The bands, labels, and all the people who put work into this need to make money to survive and be able to continue. But it is not only downloaders who make this difficult I see it everywhere and it makes me feel so dirty but that is a while different topic.
TwizstedJesus
Member
- Mar 1, 2004
- 1,219
- 24
- 38
Originally Posted by skyrefuge View Post
This seems backwards to me. I would say that it's much easier to get fucked with CDs than mp3s. If your home has a fire or is burglarized (and as this thread shows, those are not just theoretical possibilities), how do you recover that rare recording in that case? Whereas, if you're using a non-physical storage medium, when a hard drive dies or gets destoyed/stolen, you just go to your backup and immediately restore it.
I'm always going to feel "wrong" about digital media, and backing up your music on a website, or another hard-drive, while it should be done I'm sure 75 % of peeps do not have back-ups of their music collection! Do you have secondary copies of all of your discs stored somewhere other than the originals in case of a fire? I didn't think so. The chance of your house being burglarized or burned down is 1 in a million compared to a hard drive crashing. Thats not even a sane argument. I've had my CD collection for 25 years without a housefire or burglarization, but I have had 4 hard drives crash in 10 years...Am I just one of the lucky ones?
This seems backwards to me. I would say that it's much easier to get fucked with CDs than mp3s. If your home has a fire or is burglarized (and as this thread shows, those are not just theoretical possibilities), how do you recover that rare recording in that case? Whereas, if you're using a non-physical storage medium, when a hard drive dies or gets destoyed/stolen, you just go to your backup and immediately restore it.
I'm always going to feel "wrong" about digital media, and backing up your music on a website, or another hard-drive, while it should be done I'm sure 75 % of peeps do not have back-ups of their music collection! Do you have secondary copies of all of your discs stored somewhere other than the originals in case of a fire? I didn't think so. The chance of your house being burglarized or burned down is 1 in a million compared to a hard drive crashing. Thats not even a sane argument. I've had my CD collection for 25 years without a housefire or burglarization, but I have had 4 hard drives crash in 10 years...Am I just one of the lucky ones?
TribunalRecords
Record Label(s)/Vocalist
It was impressive, hell still is. And he still hits me up for stuff like that Worldtrade, yeah glad to help
and if i can paraphrase your statement when you traded your good copy for my water damaged copy you said something to the effect of. "yeah man, i listened to that World Trade CD again and it still sucks."
gotcha. haha.
Pelata
FINAL SIGN
and if i can paraphrase your statement when you traded your good copy for my water damaged copy you said something to the effect of. "yeah man, i listened to that World Trade CD again and it still sucks."
gotcha. haha.
Pfft...World Trade was boring...
Jasonic
Doom On!
I am going to throw something out on the table.
It seems like it's more of the older guys here (myself included) who consider their physical formats (tapes, CDs, vinyl, etc) to be part of a "collection" and not just a format for the tunes.
I know speaking for myself, as much as I love my IPOD, there are MANY bands where I will ALWAYS have to own the physical copy of the disc, because in addition to the tunes, I need it for my collection of the band (main bands for me would be Maiden, Motorhead, Helloween, Trouble, etc).
Anyhow, while the internet has been amazing (no doubt about it) for getting music to the masses (regardless of legally or illegally) do you think it has resulted in today's new breed of fans becoming more casual about the bands they like?
I won't name any names, but there are a lot of people on this forum and others I read who definitely seem more interested in the social aspect of the metal scene than the actual music itself. I guess this isn't so bad, since these fans purchase tickets to shows which supports.
For me personally, I spend a lot more money a year on CDs and downloads than I do on tickets, since each year I go to less and less shows. (just becomes harder as kids get older, etc).
So what are your thoughts on this?
I know for me growing up, it was the album covers that drew me in to SO SO many bands, and hunting for albums was my entire life. I was indeed a vinyl junkie, so bad that about 10 years ago, I had to go cold turkey!! (Though collecting CDs can be just as bad with all the damn special pressings, imports, etc).
It seems like it's more of the older guys here (myself included) who consider their physical formats (tapes, CDs, vinyl, etc) to be part of a "collection" and not just a format for the tunes.
I know speaking for myself, as much as I love my IPOD, there are MANY bands where I will ALWAYS have to own the physical copy of the disc, because in addition to the tunes, I need it for my collection of the band (main bands for me would be Maiden, Motorhead, Helloween, Trouble, etc).
Anyhow, while the internet has been amazing (no doubt about it) for getting music to the masses (regardless of legally or illegally) do you think it has resulted in today's new breed of fans becoming more casual about the bands they like?
I won't name any names, but there are a lot of people on this forum and others I read who definitely seem more interested in the social aspect of the metal scene than the actual music itself. I guess this isn't so bad, since these fans purchase tickets to shows which supports.
For me personally, I spend a lot more money a year on CDs and downloads than I do on tickets, since each year I go to less and less shows. (just becomes harder as kids get older, etc).
So what are your thoughts on this?
I know for me growing up, it was the album covers that drew me in to SO SO many bands, and hunting for albums was my entire life. I was indeed a vinyl junkie, so bad that about 10 years ago, I had to go cold turkey!! (Though collecting CDs can be just as bad with all the damn special pressings, imports, etc).
